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275647 Posts in 27717 Topics by 4285 Members Latest Member: - Jason DAngelo Most online today: 141 - most online ever: 565 (October 17, 2020, 02:08:06 PM)
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Author Topic: Getting People to Play Your Games  (Read 2300 times)
Matt Gwinn
Acts of Evil Playtesters
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Posts: 547


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« on: June 06, 2002, 01:39:01 PM »

Paul asked me to write a post about how I got people to play Kayfabe.  I'm not sure if it belongs here or in actual play, but I'll take a shot and post it here.

First I'd like to say that the Forge had far more to do with the game getting designed than it did in getting people to play it.  As far as I know the only person on the Forge that played it and mentioned it in actual play was Ron and he didn't even like it.

I'd say that 95% of Kayfabe's play has come from outside sources.  It started with posts on RPG.net that I had a new game I wanted people to play.  People responded to it and I was right there to respond to them.  I monitored the posts so i could answer any questions that came up.  I believe my hands on approach played a big part in Kayfabe getting played.  My site started getting a few hits and word slowly spread.  A group in California and a group in Germany started to play and I kept in close contact with them.  Then the first review hit over at rpg.net and things started to blossum.

From there I scoured the net for gaming forums.  I did searches on all of them for wrestling and posted something about my game.  From there I started going to the E-fed sites and posted there and on the wrestling site forums.  Eventually I got another review on RPG.net and another at the Pro Wrestling Simulator Enthusiasts web site.  THat got people to my site downloading the game.  From there I've been getting emails every week from people wanting to take part in playtesting.  My Kayfabe page has gotten over 3000 visitors since August and my playtest group has 28 members.

Getting people to play your game is all about motivation and getting the word out.  You can't post something on the Forge one time and expect people to play your game.  I have had Cats posted on my site longer that Kayfabe and it has a 10th of the traffic.  Ya know why?  because after I found out John Wick was working on a cat game I layed off and never mentioned it again.  Before that people were playing it as far away as France.

So, if you want people to play your game, get up off your ass and advertise it soemwhere.  FInd an audience and throw it at them.

Think a game you didn't design deserves play?  Tell the game designer.  I think encouragement and positive reinforcement play a big part in getting people motivated to advance their games -at least it did with me.  I've had my days where I'd say, "fuck it, I'm not gonna make any money on this.  Why bother."  Then I'll go to RPG.net and see Cynthia post about how Kayfabe is the second best roleplaying game she's ever played (second to Champions) and  I get giddy again and get back to work.  Or I'll get an email from total strangers like these:

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Hello. This is Rob Wood from World of Gangsta's Wrestling Federation and I was wondering if i could construct an interview with you about Kay Fabe.


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I have just downloaded the new version of Kayfabe. Read it through within half an hour, and my excitement grew  from page to page. R-e-s-p-e-c-t! The new Kayfabe is a mature roleplaying game. I feel dizzy when I think about the possibilities...


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Hi....Im a retired worker from the NC area.....been reading over your rough draft for Kayfaybe....you have a great idea and seem to have talked to a few workers...hell might be a worker...you have got it together and congrats


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I'm sorry I didn't learn about your game sooner, but as soon I seen Kayfabe... I was like, "Holy shit! This is the rpg I've been looking for!" You gotta let me in on whats happening with Kayfabe right now.


Things like that have kept me motivated and are pretty much the only reason I have continued publisising Kayfabe and plan to sell it at GENCON, as even if I sell out I will not make my money back.

,Matt Gwinn
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Kayfabe: The Inside Wrestling Game
On sale now at
www.errantknightgames.com
Ron Edwards
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« Reply #1 on: June 06, 2002, 01:51:52 PM »

"... and he didn't even like it."

?? C'mon, Matt, you wrong me. Who told you the game was a winner? Who said, "Put that Donate button up at your site"? Regardless of how much money it makes you, the point is that I think the game is worth paying for.

Judge for yourselves: Kayfabe: lots of questions.

Back to the point, I agree with all of your points regarding actual play and promotion. They correspond to Cynthia's points about the same thing, and to my experience with Sorcerer back when it was waaaaay low-budget.

Best,
Ron
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Matt Gwinn
Acts of Evil Playtesters
Member

Posts: 547


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« Reply #2 on: June 06, 2002, 02:06:50 PM »

Sorry Ron.
I didn't mean to imply that you thought it was a bad game.  Your praise of the concept and the game itself has been very influencial.  Much of the current rewrite is based on many of your suggestions.

All I meant was that I fealt you didn't "LIKE" it as much as say Dust Devils or the Pool which are games that get metioned on a regular basis.  Plus, you never actually reviewed it like I thought you would, and you said I'd only sell 5 copies at GENCON which was kind of a shot to the heart.

,Matt
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Kayfabe: The Inside Wrestling Game
On sale now at
www.errantknightgames.com
Paul Czege
Acts of Evil Playtesters
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Posts: 2341


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« Reply #3 on: June 06, 2002, 02:14:56 PM »

Hey Matt,

So, you've got a mailing list? And you're active in promoting Kayfabe on a number of online forums? Have you had any detractors on those sites? How did you handle it?

Wasn't it easy to maybe run afoul of posting etiquette, essentially advertising a game on those sites? How did you avoid that?

Paul
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And if you're doing anything with your Acts of Evil ashcan license, of course I'm curious and would love to hear about your plans
Matt Gwinn
Acts of Evil Playtesters
Member

Posts: 547


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« Reply #4 on: June 06, 2002, 02:37:08 PM »

Ya know, I haven't really had many detractors, at least none come to mind.  There have been a lot of people that have made suggestions, but in most of those cases it was because they desired to make the game even better than they thought it already was.  A big part of it was taking everyone serious.  In essense I made my fans a part of the processes by making them aware that I took their suggestions serious and that even though I may not agree with them and may not implement their suggestions their input was important to me.  People have noticed that and have mentioned it to others.

The weird thing is that I've had the most negative critisism about the art, which I can't do much about.  A lot of people think it works well enough.

I haven't heard anything negative from other forums about advertising my game there.  I think I avoided bad etiquette by posting in advertising forums and when I posted elsewhere I worked my game into the converstaion.  I guess I just shaped my post to fit in the appropriate slot.

,Matt
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Kayfabe: The Inside Wrestling Game
On sale now at
www.errantknightgames.com
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