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Quote from: JephI'm guessing that most of the time, if the connection is not obvious, the player will have to supply the reason, and then choose the element based upon that. However, it's really up to the GM.

That clears things up for me. I was imagining more strict guidelines for element use. Along the lines of "this warrior is weak against fire attacks" or something.

I would strongly suggest you don't leave it up to the GM. Either leave it up to a group decision before play, or make a stand, as designer, about how elements are used. My bias would be the latter; explicitly state resolution as: Player supplies reason which guides element choice.

You then run into the possible problem, however, of people only using their highest element score and working all situations towards that element. If this is fine with you as a design decision (i.e., characters are supposed to concentrate on a single favored element), then run with it! Otherwise, look into the implications of player-driven bonuses.

Lastly, if you're going to use Chinese words, remember that Chinese is a written language, and has many spoken variations. Hong Kong cinema uses Cantonese much more often than Mandarin.

Oh, one more last: There's a great website, if you haven't been there already: http://www.illuminatedlantern.com/ It's got tons of filmographies and excellent reviews & essays, all geared towards Asian cinema.

I've thought for a bit on players always justifying their strongest element, and decided that that could be a good thing. As each of the Elements is associated with a few emotions, you'll get rich characters that are very well defined by their Elements (in theory, at least). Since the probability gaps between doubles and triples are so big, 1 extra die for using your Mastery element doesn't make that much of a difference systemwise, anyway.

Pagoda v2 should be ready soon. It will include . . .

• An updated Elements cycle, using the standard five Chinese elements
• Chi, replaving Void Points, and guidelines on using it as a reward system (and leash, if absolutely neccessary)
• An expanded intro, including the standard 'what is roleplaying' schtick, and a bit more about Wuxia.
• Finished sections and Shamanistic and Elemental magic. (side note: Shaman is Dang-Ki, and Sorcerer is Yao Ren, right?)

I'm also looking for various bits of Sun Tzu, I Ching, etc., and Wuxia movie quotes to place under the section headings. The original document is coming along nicely, with the character for one of the five elements as a background on each page, and a slightly darker and smaller version of the character behind each of the paragraphs where the Elements are described.

Pagoda version 2.0
By Jeffrey Shcecter

About Pagoda

   Pagoda is a role-playing game. In a role-playing game, players take on the persona of a fictional character, and react to a fictional environment provided by the Game Master. Remember when, as a child, you played House? That was a form of role-playing. Although Pagoda is played around a table, with dice, a pencil, and paper, the principle remains the same.

   Pagoda is a game of wuxia, or melodramatic chinese martial arts. While wuxia features wild, high-strung, fast paced crazy kung fu martial arts, that is not what the genre is truly about. Wuxia is not about fighting, it is about why the characters are fighting; their motivations and drives.

   Characters in Pagoda are made up of three Degrees: Elements, Aspects, and Paths. When a character performs a task, the Element chosen represents why they are doing this. The Aspect chosen represents how they are doing this. The Path chosen represents what they are actually doing. There are five components of each of the first two Degrees, and an infinite number of Paths, although any given character possesses only five.

Elements

   The First Degree of a character is their Elements. Elements are the base components of the world; they are the things that bind the universe and all living things together. Characters can Sense (1) two elements, are in Harmony (2) with two other elements, and have Mastery (3) of the fifth. The five Elements are Water, Wood, Fire, Earth, and Metal.

   The Water (Shui) element is a still pond, a reservoir of great, untapped energy. Water is the element of Winter and extreme Yin. Those who are stressful and passionate find that Water drains from them, while the calm, cool, and even minded store Water. A character who has Mastery of Water must be in Harmony with Wood, and can only Sense Earth.

   The Wood (Mu) element is a coiled spring, waiting to release its explosive energy. Wood is the element of Spring, and is the New Yang. Wood represents youth, vigor, growth, and sexuality. Those in which Wood flows strongly are free spirits, expressive and constantly changing. Blocking Wood results in frustration, jealousy, and anger. A character who has Mastery of Wood must be in Harmony with Fire, and can only Sense Metal.

   The Fire (Huo) element is a blossoming flower, showering the world with energy in a great burst. Fire is the element of Summer, a time of heat and flourishing life, and represents the Full Yang. Fire is associated with compassionate love, joy, openness, and generosity. If a man blocks Fire, he will experience fits of hysteria and nervousness, and be plagued by heart problems and hypertension. A character who has Master of Fire must be in Harmony with Earth, and can only Sense Water.

   The Earth (Tu) element is a brown field of waving wheat, contented in its state of harmony with the world around it. Earth is the element of the point where Summer fades into Autumn, and is the perfect balance between the Yin and the Yang. Earth is associated with mellowness, contented peace, and lazy easy living. Blocking Earth results in impaired digestion, as the center of the organism is thrown off balance. Characters who have Mastery of Earth must be in Harmony with Metal, but can only Sense Wood.

   The Metal (Jin) element is an egg, drawn into its self for storage, until the energy inside is needed by the world. Metal is the element of Autumn, when crops are being brought in for reserve and all are settling in for winter, and is the state of New Yin. Metal is associated with cleansing, preparation, and meditative insight on what is to come. Blocking Metal results in hanging onto the past, melancholy, and grief, which results in breathing problems and low immunity. Characters who have Mastery of Metal must be in Harmony with Water, and can only Sense Fire.

Aspects

   The Second Degree of a character is their Aspects. As Elements are the foundations of the world, Aspects are the foundations of a human being. Characters are Adept (1) in two Aspects, Strong (2) in two Aspects, and Prodigious (3) in the fifth. The five Aspects are Power, Grace, Cunning, Awareness, and Presence.

   Power is a character's muscle and endurance. Power is the ability to hit hard, be hit hard, and remain standing. A high Power might be required to lift a fallen tree, or to budge the great boulder blocking the entranceway of an ancient shrine to the deities.

   Grace is a character's finesse and agility. Grace is the ability to strike precisely, and to not be where blows land. A high Grace might be required to leap a great distance, or to slip quietly past the alert guard waiting at the entrance to the Emperor's chamber.

   Cunning is a character's wit and imagination. Cunning is the ability to trick an enemy, and to realize when one is being fooled. A high Cunning might be required to survive in a barren desert, or to convince the province that the Celestial Mandate has abandoned their ruler.

   Awareness is a character's perception and the acuteness of their senses. Awareness is the ability to find a hidden clue, and to realize when something is missing. A high Awareness might be required to notice someone sneaking up behind you, or to react to the man with the poison-tipped blow dart in time.

   Presence is a character's bearing and willpower. Presence is the ability to cow others, and to hold your head high when disgraced. A high Presence might be required to intimidate the provincial duke into submission, or to continue the charge in spite of a wound.

Paths

   The Third Degree of a character is their Paths. Where Aspects are the basic structures of a man, Paths are how the architect chooses to elaborate upon those structures. Characters are Followers (1) of two paths, Accomplished (2) at two paths, and Legendary (3) in a fifth. Some sample Paths are described below.

• The Path of the Sword teaches melee weaponry and fighting.
• The Path of the Fist teaches unarmed martial arts.
• The Path of the Bow teaches ranged weaponry and archery.
• The Path of the Shaman teaches ancestral and spirit magic.
• The Path of the Sorcerer teaches elemental magic.
• The Path of the Beast teaches the handling and riding of animals.
• The Path of the Honorable teaches honor and glory.
• The Path of the Invisible teaches stealth and ambush.
• The Path of the General teaches leadership and tactics.
• The Path of the Emperor teaches intrigue and statesmanship.
• The Path of the Survivor teaches self-preservation.
• The Path of the Lover teaches passion and emotion.
• The Path of the Magi teaches knowledge and understanding.
• The Path of the Balanced teaches harmony between all elements and with all else.
• The Path of the Scourge teaches intimidation and brutality.
• The Path of the Vengeful teaches justice and revenge.
• The Path of the Meditative teaches introspection and careful consideration.
• The Path of the Body teaches fitness and athleticism.
• The Path of the Laymen teaches crafts and professions.
• The Path of the Merchant teaches acquiring wealth and determining value.

   These are only some of the possible paths. Literally an infinite number of paths could be created, but the amount of overlap would be immense. As a general rule, a Path should be a particular characteristic of an Aspect or element, although exceptions to this rule are fine, as long as the Path makes sense.

Flaws

   No man or woman in history has ever been close to perfect, and neither are characters in Pagoda. Although not a Degree, Flaws are a vital part of any character. People are defined by what they can't do, as much as by what they can. Players will create one predominant Flaw for their character.

   A Flaw will be attached to a particular Element, Aspect, or Path. Note that you cannot attach a Flaw to a path that you do not have, and if you are a Master of the Void, you cannot attach a Flaw to an Element.

   Once you have chosen an Element, Aspect, or Path for your Flaw, you must briefly describe it. Example descriptions are Overconfident (for Fire), Blindness (for Awareness), and Uncontrollable (for the Path of Sorcery).

   Now you must explain why this Flaw hinders your character, and how it may help. Note that both parts of a Flaw are equally important. Continuing the Blindness example from above, the obvious hindrance is that the character cannot see. However, they have come to realize that the other senses are equally important, and have honed their senses of smell and hearing.

The Rules of the Game

   Note the numerical value that goes along with each descriptor of an Element, Aspect, or Path. While the descriptors are more aesthetically pleasing, it is upon these numbers that the 'mechanics' of the game are based.

   When a character attempts a difficult action, their player must choose an Element and an Aspect that pertain to that action. If they can, they may also choose a relevant Path. As stated earlier, the Element represents why the character is doing something, the Aspect represents how they are doing it, and the Path represents what they are doing. For instance, slaying a bandit might be a Fire / Grace / Path of the Sword task, if you are ridding the countryside of this man out of compassion for the peasants, with style and poise, and using a weapon. If you were slaying the bandit because he has seduced the girl you love, you would use the Wood element, as you are acting out of jealousy.

   The player will then roll a number of normal six-sided dice equal to the sum of the numerical values of the Element, Aspect, and maybe Path selected. If they roll at least a doubles (two dice show the same number), they have succeeded at the action. Easier and harder actions might require different rolls, as shown on the table below.

Difficulty         Roll                     Example
Easy                 None                   Jump over a mountain stream
Difficult           Doubles            Walk on water as if it were solid ground
Very Hard       Triples               Land unscathed from a fifty foot fall
Legendary      Quadruples         Punch through a foot of solid brick
Impossible      Quintuples         Climb a mile-high vertical cliff in ten minutes

   If a character is taking an action that is being actively resisted by another player, the roll that they need is not set. Instead, both players make a roll. The roll in which more dice show the same number is superior (triples beats doubles, and so on). If both rolls are tied in this respect, the game master decides who wins the conflict. This type of character against character confrontation is called an Opposed Roll, while other rolls are known as Unopposed Rolls.

Chi

   Chi is a character's spirituality, their harmony with themselves and with the rest of the world. Chi flows through all things, it is a force of life, created by the Yin and the Yang, the balanced elements.

   In Pagoda, characters can use Chi to perform amazing feats. When a player spends a point of Chi on a roll, the result of that roll is increased by one step (doubles to triples, triples to quadruples, and so on). The player must decide to spend the Chi before they make roll any dice, and after the dice have been rolled, they may not take it back. Only one point of Chi may be spent per roll.

   Each character starts the game with an amount of Chi equal to the numerical value of their Earth element, since Earth is has a balanced Yin and Yang. At the end of a scene, the Game Master may choose to reward a point of Chi to a character. They should do so whenever the character role plays very well, is helped or hindered greatly by their Flaw, or spices up a fight scene with good description of their moves and motivations.

   The Game Master should keep this in mind: just as Chi can be used as a reward, it can, if absolutely necessary, be used as a leash. If a player completely goofs off during a scene, ruining the feel of the game, the Game Master should take away one of their points of Chi at the end of the scene.

Fighting

   When two characters engage in combat, they will make a series of Opposed Rolls. During a combat, time is divided into rounds; periods of time in which each character can take one or more actions. Each round is about three seconds long in real-time terms.

   At the beginning of a round, each player will make a roll, using either the Air or Fire Element, either the Awareness or Grace Aspect, and the Path of either the Sword, Fist, or Bow. A doubles indicates that the character can take two actions during the turn, a triples means three actions, and so on. A character take a reaction (such as parrying a sword) any number of times, regardless of the result of their roll.

   Actions include things like attacking with any weapon, attempting to trip or disarm an opponent, disengaging from a melee, or rerolling a reaction. Characters can take an action whenever they like, as long as no other character is currently taking an action, and they haven't used their full allotment for the round. When multiple characters attempt to act at the same time, the Game Master determines who acts first. When all characters are out of actions, a new round begins.

   When a character hits another character in combat, the defender takes a point of damage. If the defender didn't get a duplicate roll (they didn't even get doubles), they take one extra point of damage, unless the attacker made a similarly miserable roll. If the attacker's roll was at least two degrees higher than the defender's (quadruples against doubles, for example), the defender takes one more point of damage.

Injury

   When a character has taken at least as much damage as the numerical value of their Power Aspect, they are Injured, and whenever they make a roll, they roll one less die. When they have taken at least as much damage as the combined numerical values of their Power Aspect and Metal Element, they are Wounded, and their rolls are penalized by two dice. When they have taken more damage than the combined numerical values of their Power and Presence Aspects and their Earth Element, the pain has driven them unconscious. If they take any more damage, they will most likely die.

   Note that combat is not the only scenario in which characters take damage. For instance, a Sorcerer will take damage if they are not careful with their spells. If a character falls off of the highest tower in the Emperor's palace, they will most likely take a few points of damage, then. Note that the Game Master should rarely, if ever, assign more than three points of Mage to a hazard.

   Damage does not stay with a character forever. When characters are at rest for a substantial period of time, they may make an appropriate roll. If the character scores doubles, they recover one point of damage. Triples indicates that they are relieved of two points, and so on.

Shamanism

   Two types of magic are featured in Pagoda: Shamanism, and Elemental Magic. Shamanism is more practical, relating to the everyday lives of the peasants and serfs who work the fields. A Shaman, or Dang-ki, gets their magic from the spirits of their ancestors, and genus loci, spirits of the land, who they beseech for information and favors. Most Shamans owe a lot to the Spirit World for the services that they have requested.

   Casting a Shamanistic spell usually requires a few minutes of meditation, usually with incense, and in a family shrine or serene glade. During this time, the Shaman contacts a family or natural spirit, and asks them for a favor. The Game Master will give the favor a difficulty, usually either Doubles or Triples. If the player fails to meet the difficulty, the spirit refuses. If they meet the difficulty but no more, the spirit complies, but asks a favor of the caster in exchange. If the Shaman rolls at least a step higher than the Difficulty, the spirit complies without requesting compensation.

   There are a few favors that Shamans ask most commonly. Healing is always needed, and friendly spirits can provide magical restoration. Information is also a precious commodity, and those of the Spirit World are quite knowledgeable, indeed. Spirits of the land can be asked to increase a field's bounty, or malevolent nature spirits can be persuaded to haunt a spot, or plague a man with ill fortune.

   Shamans can also exercise their will over weaker spirits. With a successful Opposed Roll, a Shaman can anchor a spirit to the physical world, stranding it away from home. Similarly, they can put a curse on a spirit, causing bad luck to their descendants or the land that they inhabit.

   When a Shaman's spell fails (they lose an Opposed Roll with a spirit or don't meet the difficulty of a request), the Shaman loses one point of Chi, if they have any remaining. If they do not, they are obligated to help the spirit that they asked a favor of or tried to overpower in its time of need.

Elemental Magic

   Those who wield Elemental Magic are knows as Sorcerers, or Yao Ren. The power of the Sorcerer does not stem from the Spirit World, as does the power of the Shaman. Rather, Sorcerers force their will directly upon the Elements, bending them as they see fit. Elemental Magic is more direct and powerful than Shamanism, but also much more dangerous.

   Using Elemental Magic usually takes only one standard combat round. A Sorcerer can manipulate any aspect of any element. For instance, making a tree grow to tremendous height would be the direct application of Wood, while cursing a mother with sterility would be a completely different application of the same Element. Causing a man to burst into flames would be a direct application of Fire, while making them see you as an old friend would be an emotional application.

   When a Sorcerer wishes to affect a creature with their magic, to do so, they must succeed at an Opposed Roll. When they wish to affect only nature, or a man-made object, the Game Master will assign a difficulty to the spell. Simple, small scale spells, such as lighting a fire, should have doubles difficulty, while larger and more powerful spells, such as withering all the crops in a field, might take a triples. Truly tremendous tasks, such as toppling a mountain, should definitely take longer than casting a standard, smaller spell, and have quadruples or greater difficulty.

   When a Sorcerer miscasts a spell (rolls at least a step lower than the difficulty or, in the case of an Opposed Roll, a step lower than their opponent's roll), the raging elemental energies that they try to control burst free, dealing some damage to them and the surrounding area. Spells with a set difficulty deal one point of damage for doubles difficulty, two points for triples difficulty, and so on. Spells that require an Opposed Roll deal one point of damage in the case of Wood or one of the Yin elements, and two points of damage in the case of a Yang element.

----------------------------

Okay, my next step will be a bit more minor tweaking (or major tweaking, depending on your feedback), and then a bunch of flavor text. A quote from some Eastern philosopher under each heading, followed by a paragraph or two of bad fiction, a sample Wuxia setting, and so on. Erm . . . not a sample setting under each heading, just one at the back or something. ;-) If anyone would like a copy of the .pdf (which is much prittier than a bunch of text in a forum), just email me at Jeph88@mindspring.com

What are your literary/film sources for the two different types of magic? The wuxia I've seen featuring magic (my favorites being Mr. Vampire and A Chinese Ghost Story) hasn't made an elementalist/priest split. In fact, most magic I've seen stems entirely from Buddhism + Daoism + dramatic license.

Wait, I take that back. Just use the above comment as a short filmography. Have you seen The Storm Riders? It's ALL about the elemental magic. Though it's more focused on elemental magic tied directly to martial arts.
In Pagoda, are Shamans and Sorcerers separate from warriors? I sure hope not.

Okay, one more note: Your magic dichotomy reads suspiciously like a priest/wizard split. I would advise against this, because the priestly magic of wuxia certainly isn't hampered by meditation or favors from spirits. Witness kung-fu priests throwing fireballs, flinging paper scrolls (seemingly from nowhere), warding evil through the sutras, etc.

There's nothing in the rules to say that you can't be Legendary in the Path of the Fist and Accomplished in the Path of the Sorcerer, or something. So if you wanna be able to fight and talk to spirits, go for it! Similarly, you can take both the Path of the Sorcerer and the Path of the Shaman, if you want to have the magic thing covered all-round.

Actually, the more priestly magic is Elemental. Might want to check out the Shugengas in l5r, that's kinda what I'm aiming at, there.

Actually, I sort of wonder where your shamanism comes from... there's plenty of wuxia with the elementalism-style magic floating around, but the shamanic route has (to my knowledge) less evidence in the source.  On the other hand, it appears in a lot of games; Nobilis and Shadowrun both have a strong shamanic element.  On the third hand, I really like shamanism, especially the way you've provided a way to determine how negotiations with the spirit went (a feature crucially missing from my Shadowrun experience).

It seems to me, in fact, that you could fold at least part of the magic system into the Element cycle you've already set up; while your dicepools will fluctuate with regard to what element you're using, it seems strange to me that a sorceror who can Sense fire can throw fireballs around.

On the fourth hand, if anyone wanted to run a non-wuxia oriental flavored game with the system, Shamanism might be useful . . . on the fifth hand, you could probably find a few Wuxia movies with Shamanism, if you looked . . . eek, two and a half people's worth of hands, time to stop. =)

About Sorcery: You mean, perhaps, make each Element a seperate Path? Or maybe you only take The Path of the Sorcerer, and automatically have access only to your Mastery and Harmony elements for the purposes of casting? Or your Mastery element, the element that it helps, and the element that helps it?

There's one thing that bugs me about Elemental Magic: When you cast an Elemental spell, do you choose your Element based on the type of spell used, or based on your motivations for casting the spell? I'm indecisive about that point, at the moment.

Also, should characters without the correct Path be allowed to use spells, if it's somewhere in thier character concept? Or should spells be off limits unless you're at least a Follower of one of the magic Paths? I'm thinking the latter, rather than the former.

Oh, and I remembered what those scrolls are called, that the priests chuck about: Ofudas. I'll write those in under sorcery, somewhere . . .

Quote from: JephThere's one thing that bugs me about Elemental Magic: When you cast an Elemental spell, do you choose your Element based on the type of spell used, or based on your motivations for casting the spell? I'm indecisive about that point, at the moment.

Why not both?

QuoteOh, and I remembered what those scrolls are called, that the priests chuck about: Ofudas. I'll write those in under sorcery, somewhere . . .

See, these scrolls are religious in nature, so I'm not sure why you'd place them in sorcery. At least, the sorcery described as "harnessing the elements."

I like the Magic as just another Path approach. This keeps you from being restrained within shamanism and sorcery. Both shamanism and sorcery have a cost to use, and a cost for failure. Why separate them so much?

Zak, I'm not getting it when you say "why not both?" Do you mean that the player chooses, that the elemental nature of the spell reflects the caster's purpose, that they use the average between the elements, that they use both elements in addition to an Aspect/Path, that they use two elements and a path instead of an element, an aspect, and a path . . . please elaborate.

So, you're suggesting that instead of having a Path of the Shaman and a Path of the Sorcerer, just have a Path of the Spirit World or whatever that gives access to both? Seems plausible, if that's the way most people feel about it, then that's the way it shall be. So, most people, two paths or one?

Quote from: Zak ArntsonHong Kong cinema uses Cantonese much more often than Mandarin.

Yeah, but it depends on what era of wuxia you're trying to emulate.  Classic (i.e. older) wuxia all comes out of Hong Kong, where people speak Cantonese, so of course the movies follow the same pattern.  However, more recently, directors are starting to film in Mandarin, because it's the national spoken language, and most people can understand it, if not speak it (unlike Cantonese, which is really only used in South China).  That's why recent, big budget wuxia films like Crouching Tiger and Hero were filmed entirely in Mandarin.  Also, all Chinese movies come dubbed in Mandarin and Cantonese (with character subtitles), though the American versions often only have Cantonese and English.

Personally, I think Mandarin (and, more importantly, the Pinyin romanization system) is the best way to represent Chinese in English-speaking countries.  Students of Chinese are almost always going to learn Mandarin first, and then move on to other dialects.  Most Chinese dictionaries, as well, are organized based on the Pinyin system.

Quote from: JephThe Path of the Magi teaches knowledge and understanding.

Any chance you can rename this The Path of the Sage or Magistrate?  It's the only one that stood out as especially non-Chinese sounding.

QuoteAs for other terms, maybe for other intrinsic character qualities. What would be the best Chinese term for a Flaw? A Path?

Flaw: In modern Chinese, the most common term for this kind of thing is "Mao Bing," which covers everything from wounds to handicaps to mental disabilities to character flaws.  If you want something a little less harsh-sounding, I'd go with "Que Dian," which just means "shortcoming" or "weakness."

Path: This is easy, "Dao," as in "the Way" of Daoism.  It's used all over the place in the martial arts.  What the Japanese call "Aikido" is "Ai Qi Dao" in Chinese, "the Way of Loving Chi."

QuoteWith the restructuring of the Elements used in the game, I'm considering renaming Void points. Perhaps Chi points?

The problem you're going to run into is using different phoenetic systems to represent Chinese words.  The spelling "Chi" is pronouced "Chih" in Pinyin and sounds like the verb "to eat."  The word that we often spell as Chi is actually spelled "Qi" in Pinyin (sounding like "chee").  Still, most Americans would recognise Chi and not Qi, so, as much as I hate to say it, you might have to mix systems.

QuoteMight want to check out the Shugengas in l5r, that's kinda what I'm aiming at, there.

Well, Legend of the Five Rings is more based on Japanese culture, and very, very loosely at that.  Definitely comes out of the tradition of exotifying Asian culture.  Look to it for inspiration, if you like, but it's definitely not an authentic depiction, especially when talking about China.

QuoteShaman is Dang-Ki, and Sorcerer is Yao Ren, right?

Um, maybe...  That's not how most Chinese people would say it in Mandarin, though.  For Sorceror, most people would say, "Wu Shi," "Shu Shi," or "Moshu Shi," all of which mean "Master of Magic" ("Shi" is "Master" and the other characters are all different ways of saying "magic").

Shaman is harder.  There's not really a distiction between magic and the spirit world in Chinese culture, as Zak hinted at.  Magicians converse with and manipulate spirits in order to use their magic, so the line between Magician and Shaman is a thin one.  Also, the words for describing magic-users aren't clearly defined.  What's the difference between a sorceror, warlock, enchanter, magician, and conjurer in standard English?  Not much.  It's the same in Chinese.

The best suggestion I have (agreeing with Zak) is to make your Shaman more obviously religious.  Have him be a priest or monk from a Daoist, Buddist, or even Confucian Temple (though the Confucians weren't much for wuxia).  If you do that, there IS a distiction between religious magic/powers and those that come from outside sources.  Generally, sorcery is evil while religious magic is okay, though there are plenty of tales of evil Buddhist or Daoist priests.  Not many stories about good sorcerors, though.

More later.
Jonathan

Movie Note:

All of you guys, if you haven't already, should go out and find a copy of SHAOLIN SOCCER.  Yes, wuxia and sports movies do mix. Absolutely hilarious and quite famous in China, besides being one of the most modern and innovative adaptations of wuxia in a while.  Then again, the same writer/actor/director/martial artist did GOD OF COOKERY several years back, combining wuxia with Iron Chef-style cooking shows. Stephen Chow is simply amazing.  

Shaolin Soccer's getting released April 11th in the US, too, even though it's almost 3 years old now.  You should be able to find a copy at places that have a good selection of Asian films.

Later.
Jonathan

Thanks a bunch for the help with terminology! Yes, the Path of the Magi actually comes from Buddhism (or is it Hinduism? I forget). At any rate, a Mage is just a wise man . . . interestingly, that's where the english term Magistrate comes from. Path of the Sage is easier to fit onto the character sheet, I'll adopt that.

More and more, combining Shamanism and Elemental Magic is looking like a good idea. Maybe just the Path of the Spirits?

Curious about advancement.

Is it possible to gain new Paths, to show the character broadening? Or is it that you simply get better in the Paths you have?

Do Elements or Aspects ever increase? Or do they shift, one point gained in one is lost in another?

I know advancement is a dirty word to some people, but it seems appropriate for this game, at least at the end of a scenario.

And yes, I'd just call it Path of the Spirits and be done with it. There's not enough of a priest/magic-user split to warrant seperation between shamans and elementalists.

Quote from: Jonathan WaltonPath: This is easy, "Dao," as in "the Way" of Daoism.  It's used all over the place in the martial arts.  What the Japanese call "Aikido" is "Ai Qi Dao" in Chinese, "the Way of Loving Chi."

Err.. Aikido = He Qi Dao. :) I must say your name was more amusing though. (Yeah, he2 as in he2shi4). So the meaning of Aikido ought to be something like "The Way of being in Harmony with Chi".

Quote from: Pale FireErr.. Aikido = He Qi Dao. :)

Err... Thanks Chris! :)  That'll teach me to pretend I know some Japanese.  But, hey, two out of three ain't bad...

Later.
Jonathan