Monsters and Mustard Gas: the embryonic stages

[AgentFresh]

Working Title: Monsters and Mustard Gas (though it may not have either as such...it beats my brainstorming title: "The Trench Project")

The one-second pitch: High Fantasy meets World War I.

The genesis: There was some sort of car wreck in my brain at the corner of Fiction St. and Fact Ave., when a random thought about WWI trench warfare hit another random thought about RPGs head on.

As a result, I had the image of an orc in a black WWI era uniform, armed with a bolt action rifle with a wicked bayonet charging up out of a trench, followed by legions of more orcs in gasmasks and such.

Other images of fantasy type races manning fire-breathing machine guns and flying archaic looking bi-planes sparked off that original flame.

Most of my ideas start out as silly little vignettes or scenes in my head, so I filed it away for future reference.

The future is now, I guess.

Current intentions: Publish (PDF & free, most likely) either as a stand-alone game, a supplement for use with an open system OR a system-free world book with rule tweak suggestions.

Early guiding thoughts: Somewhat demystified magic (magic as technology), use fantasy races more as social classes or ethnicities than nationalities, put interesting twists on both facets without abandoning the essentials of either.

The current goal: Decide how to blend the signature/most interesting/playable elements of a High Fantasy setting with the historical period.

The Big Question: How do I do the blend? I feel like I HAVE to answer this first before I can do anything else setting wise.

Option 1: D&D on Fast-Forward

My first idea was to just create a standard High Fantasy setting, and then fast-forward the setting to an early 1900s-like period. It wouldn't be Earth, the Central Powers, the Allies or World War I...but a fantasy setting that has parallels for all that. Basically, port WWI into a fantasy world the way Forgotten Realms ported Asia into a D&D world.

This option would leave me less tied to history or the dangers of stereotyping countries via certain fantasy races ("The Germans are Orcs!" for example.)

A drawback of this is that I have to run about half of Western History through a fantasy filter to get to where I want to be. Plus, a WWI-LIKE setting isn't as easy for new players to grasp as an ACTUAL WWI setting with Orcs and Elves.

Option 2: Weird parallel

Another option is just take poetic license and have WWI have the fantasy elements grafted into it with no explanation. Sort of the "What if?" approach.

This might be the easiest, but it is the least appealing to me for some reason.

Option 3: Alternate History

This is another version of a "What if?", where sometime before the era, fantasy creatures sort show up in our world. This could either be done in an "Awakening" ala' "Shadowrun" or an invasion (sort of a reverse of what happened in the GURPS fantasy setting.)

This one would be more work than option two, but not as much as option one. It would be a more standard cross-genre style setting.

On the downside, I think events like these would throw history into such a tizzy that the early 20th century may not look anything like did in our world.

Other concerns: Not enough fodder for PC centered stories. Idea too derivative. I'm not as passionate about the fantasy genre as the historical. The idea just be lame and best left on the cutting room floor of my brain. Don't want to re-invent the wheel with game mechanics.

Any feedback/artillery bombardments appreciated!

[octobernight]

I have an alright idea for how to blend it using alternate history.  Around the time of WWI, the mass movements of people all over the world allowed the easy spread of the worst flu virus ever.  Instead of killing that many people, what if the virus began to mutate them.  Since the virus just flared up mysteriously from America (might be wrong here), why not pretend it was an American created virus gone horribly wrong.  

Perhaps instead, say America injected it's soldiers with some virus to splice with their DNA to make them stronger.  Then the flu virus interacted with the American virus and the soldiers began to slowly mutate into hulking brutes.

[AgentFresh]

I have an alright idea for how to blend it using alternate history.

I appreciate the comment, but DNA splicing and genetic virruses don't mesh well with either the Fantasy RPG genre or the historical period. If I did go the Alt-Historical route...it'd probably be something mystical that made the merge happen.

[ethan_greer]

That's an excellent example of a great way to post an idea in this forum.  My hat is off to you, sir.

Regarding your idea:  Great mental image of the orcs going over the top.  I can see it in my mind, and it looks pretty cool.

To be honest, this idea sounds tailor-made to release as a d20 Modern setting - provided that d20 Modern as a system meets the goals of the types of things you want to explore using the setting.  Another option to look at would be Savage Worlds, which would also probably work well, especially for larger trench warfare battles.  Urban Arcana might be worth checking out as well for inspiration (but I don't know, as I haven't read it or even paged through it; just another idea to consider).  And finally, you might take a look at Godlike for inspiration, which is superheroes/WWII.

Magic = technology:  I see guys running around with gov. issue wands of fire instead of machine guns.  That would be interesting.

So, how to do the blend?  Personally, I actually think that option 2 would be the way I would go.  Reasons? 1, it's easier, as you point out.  2, it gets you to that mental image (orcs in trenches) immediately, with no fuss no muss.  3, it's more blatantly WWI with fantasy elements than either of the two options, which is (I think) what you're really going for.  You admit that you're more into the history angle, so grafting the fantasy elements onto actual history seems the way to go.  But that may just be me, and depends largely on the sorts of things you envision happening in play.

To tell you the truth, I think a better first step than determining how to blend would be to answer the question, "what do the PCs do in this game?"  Are they grunts in the trenches?  Commanders of grunts?  Special forces (or some WWI version of special forces, whatever that means)?  Spies?  Flying aces?  Answering this question first will guide your hand and give you a definite goal that will ease all the other decisions you need to make.

Hope this helps!

[JSDiamond]

The imagery is great, -my suggestion (setting-wise) is something more akin to Bakshi's movie "Wizards".  See it if you haven't, I think that it may spark some more ideas for you.

Idea:
Future Earth and the 'unearthed arcana' would be old weapon caches discovered by an orc warlord who quickly discovers the power he has in these ancient magical devices.

A bolt action rifle = A metal rod to tame the spirits of earth djinn contained in small brass urns, expelling hot lead as the djinn are provoked by the bolt which jars them from their slumber. Or a flame thrower containing fire djinn who struggle to escape.

And so on.... Limiting the technology to rugged WWI levels would be colorful without being overpowering and such things could be explained in a colorful way.

[iago]

Love the imagery.  It's inspiring, and thus, I give you this.

Consider for a moment that Tolkein was in fact writing about the uncomfortable advance of technology and its impact on the "simple life" of his rural childhood, when he wrote his trilogy.  Orcs and their like, in his set-up, *are* expressions of technology, or at least of its ugly advance, in his world.

This might suggest an interesting point from which your setting can depart.  What if the introduction of technology itself somehow brought about the presence of orcs and other fantasy beings into the world? What if that came about not because of any overt magic, but simply because some people in the world started to have different ideas than they did before?  In essence, what if an ideological shift to a perspective where more technology in the world is a good thing, turned you into a monster?

This starts suggesting some really interesting things to me -- like the idea that the PCs, who are not your orc-soldiers, are folks who are risking the taint of technology in order to defeat the orc menace.  But every day they pick up that machine gun, ride that tank, throw that grenade -- they're losing a little more of themselves, running the risk of becoming, in time, the beasts of technology that started the war in the first place.  It's a fate worse than death, and the soldiers have pacts with one another that they'll shoot their fellow man if it looks like he's gone over to the other side.

They are cursed guardians, in a way -- where the physical transformation echoes the psychological transformations that early 20th century man was going through (read The Wasteland to get a sense of the bleakness our first world war introduced) -- who are charged with making sure that the folks back home never have to face their ultimate fate.  They're fighting to "preserve the old way of life" -- even as the fight itself ensures that they will never be able to return to that old way themselves.

Mix it in with a couple more elements and that could really grow some legs and run like the wind.

[Simon W]

I can't get the 'Blackadder Goes Forth' series out of my head here. (in case you don't know, Blackadder is a character played by Rowan Atkinson, in a TV 'sit-com' where in each series he plays a character of the Blackadder family throughout history. In Goes Forth, he is an officer in the trenches of WW1).

I see Baldrick (his sidekick/batman, played by Tony Robinson) as a goblin or gnome and some of the other characters as half-elves and half-orcs.

I suppose the new game Victoriana, together with the old TSR For Faerie Queen & Country might be thought as as in a similar vein, although both are set a little earlier.

Simon
Beyond Belief Games
The home of Lashings of Ginger Beer

[AgentFresh]

Thank you all for the good replies and ideas

ethan_greer:

Magic = technology: I see guys running around with gov. issue wands of fire instead of machine guns. That would be interesting.

My original thought was to have some sort of mystical material that can take the place of gunpowder, coal and oil.

Or to use "like attracts like" tech. Engineers are actually skilled magicians who can build things that make the Universe want to make them work. Build something that looks like it should fly, and it probably will. (Sorry if this is fuzzy.)

But, another thought was to have regular tech with odd magic touches: Black bullets that have a worm living in them that causes extra damage or other odd effects.

JSDiamond:

A bolt action rifle = A metal rod to tame the spirits of earth djinn contained in small brass urns, expelling hot lead as the djinn are provoked by the bolt which jars them from their slumber. Or a flame thrower containing fire djinn who struggle to escape.

That's sort of how I was thinking of handling the magic/tech split. Though I want the WWI gear to be recognizable...maye just customized for the races in size and shape...or perhaps a little more ornate.

iago:

They are cursed guardians, in a way -- where the physical transformation echoes the psychological transformations that early 20th century man was going through (read The Wasteland to get a sense of the bleakness our first world war introduced) -- who are charged with making sure that the folks back home never have to face their ultimate fate. They're fighting to "preserve the old way of life" -- even as the fight itself ensures that they will never be able to return to that old way themselves.

Mix it in with a couple more elements and that could really grow some legs and run like the wind.

You may have something there. In my original idea (creating my own fantasy setting with a WWI-like feel,) I wanted to have that element of the culture "crossing the line of despair" that is a hallmark of that era. The scientific optimism of the Victorian age sort of died in the No Man's Land of chemical war and mechanized death. Even this optimism was a grasp at hope in an increasing hopeless world.

If I take this route (which feels iconic and more substantial than possilbly ephemeral "weird" appeal of the a straight WW1/Fantasy setting) I'll have to do a major rethinking of the setting and politics and such. Which might not be bad. An idea like this could take the focus off the setting and put it on the PCs.

Having the setting outshine the PCs is a fear of mine.

Gideon:

I can't get the 'Blackadder Goes Forth' series out of my head here. (in case you don't know, Blackadder is a character played by Rowan Atkinson, in a TV 'sit-com' where in each series he plays a character of the Blackadder family throughout history. In Goes Forth, he is an officer in the trenches of WW1).

I saw the Medieval, Elizabethian and King George Era "Black Adders." Never saw the WWI version. I always thought it was funny how each Black Adder seemed to go down in status as time moved on.

I suppose the new game Victoriana, together with the old TSR For Faerie Queen & Country might be thought as as in a similar vein, although both are set a little earlier.

Not familar with those. Might have to give 'em a look.

THANKS AGAIN FOR THE FEEDBACK.

I'm majorly rethinking some things. Changing some directions. That's what these early questions are for...

[simon_hibbs]

How about a slight situation-shift.

A few hundred years ago, european armies equipped with rifles, artilery and eventualy machine guns turned up in Africa and started energeticaly carving out imperial domains.

Your D&D fantasy world takes the place of Africa.

How do the Orcs, Elves, Dwarves and Men of your heroic epic fantasy world cope when the forces of Kaiser Wilhelm turn up and start setting up trading posts? And who are those men in red rumoured to be nosing about in the south?


Simon Hibbs

[Ron Edwards]

Hello,

I haven't read it, but I'm under the impression that the book Grunts!: a Fantasy with Attitude, by Mary Gentle, is based on something of the same idea. Check it out to see.

Best,
Ron

[contracycle]

Yes, I also recommend Grunts!  Its simply one of the funniest books I've ever read.  It's easy enough to give away the setup becuase, like most comedies, it happens at the start and is not in itself important. The whole saga starts when a group of orcs and some halfing spies pillage a dragons lair 'cos they heard it was dead.  This dragon was known for collecting weaponry via standard-fantasy-book-trope multidimensional portals and curses the thieves that they will "become what they steal".  Because they steal guns and a jeep, they turn into Marines.  They never stop being orcs, though.  I'm a great fan of this book, not least because of Gentle's methodical serial-killer approach to fantasy's sacred cows.

[AgentFresh]

simon_hibbs:

How about a slight situation-shift.

A few hundred years ago, european armies equipped with rifles, artilery and eventualy machine guns turned up in Africa and started energeticaly carving out imperial domains.

Your D&D fantasy world takes the place of Africa.

This could be very fertile ground as well. I am interested in the history of Colonialism (I am an American afterall.)

I think I'd rather focus on the time around WWI, but thanks for this reminder to remember the Imperial baggage of that period.

Also thanks to Ron and Contracyle for mentioning GRUNTS... I read a Gentle story called The Harvest of Wolves that I liked enough to want to adapt it into a play. I may have to check the book out for a good read and a laugh if nothing else.

Any setting inspiration would be gravy!