Editing

[davidJ]

I am curious, what are the rates for editing?

[Ben Lehman]

Anything from free "I'll look at yours if you look at mine" to $10 / hour for a cheaper editor to $20 / hour or more.

yrs--
--Ben

[Andrew Morris]

Yeah, I wouldn't charge for an indie game, I'd just have to be interested in the material or trading services with the creator. Professionally, I bill out at a whole lot more than $20/hour.

[Thor Olavsrud]

After working on three projects (Monster Burner, No Press Anthology, Burning Wheel Revised), and currently working on a fourth (With Great Power...), I've got to say that there's no way in hell I'd do it for free.

Burning Wheel Revised was a serious second job for me, over the course of several months. I consider Luke a very good friend, I love Burning Wheel, and I even donate time to going to conventions to demo/sell it and to support it online.

However, actually editing it was a serious time commitment, and I certainly couldn't take other, better-paying freelance gigs while working on it. I did it because I love it, care about the product, etc. And I did give a deep discount. But I still expected to be paid.

Obviously there are varying levels of commitment based on the size of the game and the amount of work required, and Burning Wheel is a much larger game than most games by Forge participants. A smaller game is not going to require months of work, as BWR did (by three different editors no less!).

Also, keep in mind there are different kinds of editing. Are you hiring someone for high-level/content editing, line editing (substantive editing), or just  copyediting? These are different skill sets. Most editors can do them all, but will have areas where they are better than others.

High-level/content editors are going to be questioning your ideas, helping you develop them more fully, and asking you about your assumptions. This level of editing, to a certain extent, goes on in the Indie Game Design forum right here.

Substantive or line editing includes developing accurate and logical content. It involves an examination of the basic elements of manuscript structure: pacing, voice, tone and subtext, a check for redundancies, repetition of phrases, clichés, misplaced modifiers, shifts in agreement, consistency, organization, flow, clarity, and several other things. This can involve substantial reorganization and rewriting. Generally, this process also includes ensuring that the work adheres to a style guide (terms to capitalize, whether to use serial commas, terms to avoid, proper usage, etc.). Often, copyediting is part of this process. But in a best case scenario you will still have a separate, final pass through material just for copyediting. In a best, best case scenario, this is done by someone other than the line editor.

Copyediting includes a check for errors of spelling, grammar, punctuation, and consistency of style. Generally, after a copyeditor has gone through a manuscript, and any changes have been made, there's a final proofread to check for any remaining errors and inconsistencies.

In the best of all possible worlds, you will have separate content editors, line editors (and sometimes a separate style editor), copyeditors and proofreaders. Obviously, the economics of indie-game publishing is going to force you to collapse all of this into one or two roles.

Editors often charge $30 to $35 and more per hour for their services, and even more for  editing "technical" documents. A fee of $10 an hour is absolutely dirt cheap, but there are people out there who love games and are willing to do it for this rate. I charged Luke $15 an hour.

[davidJ]

Thank you so very much for all of your comments.

They have been extremely helpful!

[Jake Richmond]

Yeah thanks. I'll never put out anothr product with out editing the hell out of it. Or having someone else edit the hell out of it. In any case, I've discovered how easy it is to look at a project your working on and not be able to see the same errors, ommisions and typos that are obvious to everyone else.


-jake

[Malcolm Craig]

Yeah thanks. I'll never put out anothr product with out editing the hell out of it. Or having someone else edit the hell out of it. In any case, I've discovered how easy it is to look at a project your working on and not be able to see the same errors, ommisions and typos that are obvious to everyone else.


-jake

I hear you there. I'm very lucky in that I have a friend who has taken on board the responsibility for editing my stuff. Lucky in that he's a senior editor with Blackwell Scientific Publishing and has over a decades experience working professionally in the editing field. Obviously, not everyone can be in that happy and fortunate situation, but the help and advice he as offered really has served to tighten up my stuff and make it much better overall. I really can't overemphasise the benefits of having a really good editor look over your work.

Cheers
Malcolm

[jdagna]

The editors I've talked to mostly charge by the word - about $.01 to $.03 per word (it's just a little less than what you'd expect to pay a writer, really).  The $.01 rate translates to more than $20/hr at the rate I can do editing, so finding someone with an hourly rate might be a cheaper way to go.  (On the other hand, the word-count method gives you a predictable cost).

It is definitely essential to have someone do editing for you, especially if you've made any major changes or revisions to your books.  I know I regret not having more editing between the prerelease and final editions of Pax Draconis.  In a few places, old rules snuck through just because I was too familiar with both versions.

[Jake Richmond]

Thats what I'm saying. Familiarity breeds laxness (?). You're more likely to miss mistakes and stuff because you are familiar with your book. Hire an impartial outsider to edit. its the best way to go.

[Frank T]

Since we seem to have some professional editors here: How long do you take to edit a text of, say, a hundred pages (12 pt Arial)? I meen, it's interesting to see hourly rates, 20 bucks really isn't much at all, but what does it add up to?

Up to now, I had just assumed that I'd get some friends of mine who know to express themselves look over the final manuscript and be done with it. Surely a professional editor can do more for you, but I have to keep my expenses reasonable. Then again, if I'm willing to pay quite some money for layout and illustration, it does occur to me as strange that I didn't think about professional editing before.

- Frank

[Thor Olavsrud]

Frank,

It really depends on the type of editing you're talking about and the text itself. For copyediting or proofing? I think an average of about 10 pages per hour is pretty reasonable, though that will vary with the text.

Substantive edits are a bit more tricky, but I usually figure an average of about five pages to eight pages per hour. Again, the actual rate is dependent on the text itself. If possible, it's a good idea to show an editor your text and ask for an estimate