[Donjon] Attack 'Facts'

[Darren Hill]

My first Donjon question. I'm comfortable with the way the Law of Successes works outside of combat, but I'm looking for guidance in combat uses.
On the forum, Clinton has espoused the philosophy that successes are meant to confirm and reinforce facts - for example, if you say - "my attack knocks my opponent off balance - 1 fact", you should also invest a couple of successes to give that opponent a dice penalty.
But Clinton also used an example (somewhere on this board) of using 3 facts as so: "the goblin staggers to the cliff's edge (1 fact), drops his sword (1 fact), and falls to his doom (1 fact)."
This seems a touch contradictory (sorry, Clinton!). I can't really see why you'd go through the rigmarole of inflicting damage if the second option is possible, since you can always finagle such an event ("I strike the opponent, sending him smashing into the dungeon wall (1 fact), and the crumbling gargoyle bust above him falls and crushes his skull (1-2 facts, maybe).

Even something as simple as "my attack knocks him over (1 fact)" sounds like it should have a few extra dice attached to it, unless you don't suffer any penalties for being downed and can say as part of a successful attack "I get up (1 fact)" - though if there are no penalties why would you need to?

What I'm considering is having a set 'fact cost' for a range of inflicted disadvantages -
    forcing an opponent into a specific position or out of a beneficial one might be 1 fact, disarming might be 2-3, knockdown likewise, and so on.

How do other people deal with this conundrum?

Just to emphasise - I don't have a problem with facts outside of combat, but in combat, when it can take many rolls to take an opponent down (especially if lucky on his resist damage roll), they seem a bit too easy.

[Jason]

According to the book, on page 36, you can either damage flesh wounds, or damage opponents attributes with a damage test (ie hitting someone with a stick). The otr stuff sounds a bit too powerful, imho.

Jason

[jdagna]

When I played Donjon with Clinton, facts were often used to make death more colorful.  So the orc falling off of a cliff example would habe been possible... if the orc had been rendered "unconscious" already (by reducing his flesh wounds).  In another example, we used a fact to dismember a goblin and another fact to have the limbs land in a cool pattern - but those were throw-away facts since we already knew the sucker was dead.

This example kind of goes back to the "Death Ray" ability or spell.  A success doesn't indicate death immediately, just injury that can lead to death.

[Christopher Weeks]

the goblin staggers to the cliff's edge (1 fact)

No problem with that fact, right?

drops his sword (1 fact)

And that fact is fine too.  Shy of other contextual factors, you've possibly robbed him of one action to regain his sword.

and falls to his doom (1 fact)

The only problem with this is "doom."  Either it's a very short cliff (more of a curb, really) or there's a ledge not far below the lip if the player doesn't also
assign some hefty damage.

No problem.

Chris