GOLEM

[JSDiamond]

hardcoremoose came up with a brilliant system-mechanic that I have altered somewhat for an rpg (tentatively) called "GOLEM"

In it, players are robots that have 'awoken' within a behemoth factory of steam pipes, forges, welding bays and assembly lines.
Some or little of the huge factory complex is operational.  Naturally, many other robots (also called 'golems') have already been functioning for some time before the characters awaken.

Characters can be one of three types of robots: Steam, Oil, or Electric.  Each with their own properties (of course).

Robots can also be of any design and have any skills, but these were determined by the factory (i.e., using the system will decide your fate as a golem) The system would use bolts (like you get at a hardware store) in a dice-bag, drawn out for resolution. Of course, all the bolts will be identical in size except for the type of metal used.

The key is that players place as many chrome colored bolts in the bag as there are players plus 1 brass bolt.

One player starts the game as GM, but this can change hands as the adventure progresses.

Whenever a significant task is at hand, the player attempting it draws out a bolt. If it is chrome, another player acts as the GM in describing the scene and actions (success, failure, flavor, etc.) until that player's character engages in some significant activity, whereupon they draw from the bag as previously described.

The kicker is that if you draw forth the brass bolt you get to describe the outcome of your character's action.  You also retain the mantle of GM.  The brass bolt is typically the one you'd want because it always indicates that it's your choice.  

Now, that's one idea.  The other is that a number of bolts in the bag would represent difficulty in succeeding at various tasks.  With drawing the brass bolt required for success.

Easy = No draw required
Medium = 1 chrome + 1 brass
Difficult = 2 chrome + 1 brass
V. Difficult = 3 chrome + 1 brass
Impossible = 4 chrome + 1 brass

This could be converted to using 1d6 by always equating a '1' as failure and a '6' as a success, with the variations of difficulty in between.

The premise could be anything really. Find out the secrets of the factory, why you are here, who built it, where is it, etc.

What do you think?

Jeff

 

[Dav]

Is there some sort of mechanic restriction built-in to keep things slightly under control?

(I draw the brass bolt and ohmigod! millions of dollars rain from the sky, and I am proclaimed Lord of the Universe!... yeah, I know I said I get a drink of soda, but that's what happened)

Seriously, though, I think it's a fun system, and one that has a good potential.  I am concerned that it might be better for a game such as Soap or similar humorously-themed games where it could be used to slightly more ridiculous outcomes without disrupting genre and plotline.  

Of course, I realize you probably summarized things incredibly here, so if I am asking about something that is already there, just smack me.

Dav

[JSDiamond]

Dav!
Well, that million dollars was in gold bullion, so your robot was crushed to scrap!

(whistling)....anyway...

Seriously, the bolts are a nifty gimmick.  But I see the system as kind of 'The Window' like in that it's one of those 'anything you can describe, but within reason and to further the story' type things.

I like the idea of swapping the GMing duties because even if a player didn't feel comfortable doing it, all could agree ahead of time that one player would be exempt from doing more than describing a single resolution (when a chrome bolt was drawn by another player).  And I did summarize *a lot* of it.  

There would also be the idea that a golem can develop a personality based upon what type of golem you initially wanted to play vs. what you end up with (since that's also randomized, after all the factory built you for something).  All golems are considered to be self-aware to varying degrees, so what you wanted to be vs. what you are functions as a kind of personality-motivation of your character (i.e., what drives you, etc.)

There would be no stats or skill lists.  Except what you determine for yourself by your design protocol.

Since combat is at the forefront of nearly every gamer's mind, with no stats to worry about each golem can withstand a number of 'breakdowns' based upon type. Tentatively, I have devised this key:

3 Minor = 1 Medium
3 Medium = 1 Major

All golems can withstand a maximum of 3 major breakdowns, with any amount of damage (even minor)past that indicating complete destruction.

Blah... I don't mean to ramble on.
I'll have this completed soon and I'll make it available to whomever wishes to try it out.


Jeff Diamond
http://www.geocities.com/allianceprime">6-0 Games
   

[hardcoremoose]

Well, I think you're further on the system than I am, but I love the concept and the mechanics.  Very cool...reminds of Paranoia a bit.  I'd play it in a heartbeat. :smile:

I guess I'm not adding much to the game design, but I think you've got it under control anyway.  BTW, loved the illustrations in ELFS. :smile:

(Yes, I know this is extraneous use of smilies, but I've been in a remarkably good mood lately) :smile:

[Ron Edwards]

Just to be a big lug wrench ...

I've never liked "draw from a bag" mechanics in actual play. They're cumbersome, time-consuming, people drop the fucking pieces, people forget to put them back, and on and on.

A lot about Golem sounds fun and useful, in the inimitable Memento-mori fashion, but that aspect of it gets up my nose.

Best,
Ron

[GreatWolf]

At the same time, the "color" provided by the bolt mechanic could be useful.  Regular dice can get boring sometimes, and I'll bet that a simple workaround could be provided to handle some of Ron's concerns.  (For example, maybe everyone has their own bag of bolts.)

I am a big fan of "color" in game mechanics, so long as the color does not overwhelm the utility.  Deadlands springs to mind as a prime example of this, where the use of cards and poker chips not only adds color to the game but, in most cases, actually improves the ease of recordkeeping and action resolution.

[Clay]

Seth,

"Color" can sometimes get in the way of playing the game.  The Deadlands example you mentioned is a prime example.  In addition to the massive bag of dice that I have to bring to the game, I'm forced to keep track of a hand or two of cards, plus a tedious assortment of poker chips.  There's too much "stuff" that I have to deal with, and it gets in the way of my game.  I'm not convinced that color was worth the complexity.

I'm a bigger fan of games which keep it simple, like Call of Cthulhu.  Few rolls are required, and always take exactly two dice.  It takes so little that we actually play it sitting around in the living room, where the cats take liberties with the gaming "stuff."  I wouldn't recommend this with a game like Deadlands.  I haven't noticed any lack of color from the lack of items we have to manipulate.  The game itself provides more than enough color.

[JSDiamond]

Okay, I have taken all of your comments to GOLEM and I am working out these solutions:

Ron: I will use Greatwolf's suggestion of each player having their own bag of bolts to minimize the hassle of it.

Clay: I have re-designed the mechanic to include only the following game pieces; (1) chrome, (1) gold, (1) black.

The key is: Chrome=another player calls it, Gold=you call it, Black=GM calls it.

Further, the GM may also be a player-character, but it isn't necessary.  So the traditional GM to Player stance can still be used if it's more comfortable.

It should be playable in a few weeks.

Jeff

[Zak Arntson]

I love the bolts.  But you'll have to make sure all the players are scrupulous enough to NOT try and detect bolts by touch ...

[GreatWolf]

On 2001-05-18 12:56, Clay wrote:

"Color" can sometimes get in the way of playing the game.  The Deadlands example you mentioned is a prime example.  In addition to the massive bag of dice that I have to bring to the game, I'm forced to keep track of a hand or two of cards, plus a tedious assortment of poker chips.  There's too much "stuff" that I have to deal with, and it gets in the way of my game.  I'm not convinced that color was worth the complexity.

Hmm.  Maybe this is an issue of varying mileage.  I actually thought that using cards for initiative in combat was a good idea independent of color, since it makes one less thing for the players to remember.  "What's my initiative again?  Oh yeah.  Five."

At the same time, I do agree that an excess of color can get in the way.  Nor would I want all my RPGs to have extra color.  As someone commented about the old GW game Space Fleet, "I wouldn't want all my games to require dice rolling in the box top, but it works nicely for this one."

[canisPRIME]

I must have a knack for designing games with names that other people want to use.

First Frag, now Golem.  

Admitedly, you did say tentatively titled 'Golem'...  

I would include a link to the website with information reguarding my game Golem, but it seems Crosswinds has moved it to a 'faster' server, so fast in fact that you cannot even see it :\

Which brings up an interesting question... is the Forge limited to strictly RPG design, or does it stretch to war games as well.  I noticed 'Junk' in the library.

Cheers,
Shane
LLC

[JSDiamond]

It figures.

Well, my sci-fi rpg supplement "Blood of Heroes" caught flak as well, as you can imagine.  I'd never heard of that game until the stiff-sounding email arrived from their president.  

Not that 'Blood of Heroes' wasn't *already* an over-used  title.  When I thought of it I was only thinking of the possible connection to that Rutger Hauer movie, I had no idea there was an rpg with that name.    

Like I'm the only person who owns a Thesaurus?
I know of only one other 'Golem' game out there, it's a card game.
http://www.rhinoventures.com/golem/">Golem Card Game

What's your 'Golem' about?  

Best,
Jeff


[ This Message was edited by: JSDiamond on 2001-05-21 02:11 ]

[canisPRIME]

At its heart I guess GOLEM is a wargame.   Two or more players are wizards who construct Golem to attack each other.

There is more to it than that of course.   I took inspiration from the RTS genre of computer games.  The whole, build a base, gather resources, destroy the enemy kind of play.

In Golem the war is basically fought over a magical resource, simply called 'ore'.  Using this ore each player can construct various golem and structures.  

The structures do various things such as allowing more advanced golem construction, or grant various special abilities to golem in play, etc.

Do you concentrate on constructing worker golem, to gather ore and build your base, or do you create masses of war golem and send them to attack your enemy.  

The terrain and structures themselves are represented by cards laid upon the table, the golem via small miniatures (fold up counters for the playtest).

On top of all that there is a single deck of cards that all players draw from representing both their magical ability and random events.   Each player draws 5 cards at the beginning of the game (new cards are drawn each turn, but no player can have more than 5 in hand).  

Events are played immediately; these are random things that happen on the field of battle, weather effects, new terrain features etc.  
Upgrade cards are basically spells, little effects you can play on you golem to boost their abilities temporarily.   Making them faster, stronger or giving them special abilities.
Legend cards are artefacts from previous wars found upon the battlefield.   These cards are in sets, and the entire set must be collected in order to use them.  One such Legend is 'Mech' (a super golem).  You need to collect the head, torso and legs of Mech in order to create him.   As a draw back, collecting legends ties up the cards in your hand.  You can only have a maximum of 5 in your hand, if you have two pieces of Mech legend cards, you only have 3 other cards you can actually use.  

That's a bit of a rough description of the game... but I really should be working rather than mucking around on the net.    

Seeya,
Shane
LLC

[Doc Midnight]

I am really digging this thing about Bolts and the colors are good as well.

I only have one question. It seems to me that this game is about everyone working together to progress the story but they will surely want to leave their tread print on it somewhere and in my mind the "Another player decides" can get a little bogged down.

Maybe something like "The player to the right of the bolt drawer decides" could solve this.

I streamlines the process a bit and that's never really a bad thing. I know it works in the Shadowfist CCG.

[Doc Midnight]

Shane, is your GOLEM a wargame ala warhamer or an RPG with a wargame style?

I'm having a hard time envisioning it without little figurines (which I don't want to deal with)or charts (which I can more readily deal with.

I like the concept though but the card thingy scares me a bit (deadlands).

I'd like to hear more.

Terry