[Cornerstone] Death

[Paganini]

I've run into a bit of a problem with my cornerstone mechanics. My current rule is as follows:

"A character is out when he runs out of positive descriptors. Out isn't neccesarily dead... it can be too depressed, too scared, etc. to do anything. It's up to the GM to decide whether or not the character is permanently out of the game, or whether he just needs some rest to heal up."

Someone recently pointed out to me that this means that a mundane character (someone with all zero level descriptors) is automaticaly out.

I really like the idea of descriptor damage, because players have to actually role-play why a descriptor should be lowered from any given damage source. But I need some sort of a breakpoint to define when a character is "out." Does anyone have any suggestions?

[Gordon C. Landis]

That is, once you reach 0 descriptors, you can still function (just like the mundane folk) - but the next "hit" puts you out.  Thus, mundane folk take 1 "hit".

The player might choose (or be forced by the system, if you want) to assume the "hit" was to some pre-existing, already-"hit" descriptor, and roleplay/describe as appropriate.

Simple approach - but maybe this is a case where simple is good.

Gordon

[Paganini]

Simple approach - but maybe this is a case where simple is good.
Gordon

I definately want something simple... that's what this game is all about. Your idea is exactly along the lines I've been thinking. The thing is, there are also "below mundane" characters, like a down and out bum, or an invalid, who aren't automaticaly out, but who have a descriptor total that is below zero. I'm almost thinking of something like a meta game mechanic, where PCs can take so much descriptor damage before being out, imporant PCs have a different number, unimportant PCs less, etc. etc.

[Laurel]

You might just have to beef up your no-descriptor and sub-descriptor chars to 1 desciptor, create a "special" mudane-only descriptor, or clarify that when primary *PCs* drop to 0 descriptors they are out of play, but the same does not hold true for "stock chars"/NPCs.

[Paganini]

You might just have to beef up your no-descriptor and sub-descriptor chars to 1 desciptor, create a "special" mudane-only descriptor, or clarify that when primary *PCs* drop to 0 descriptors they are out of play, but the same does not hold true for "stock chars"/NPCs.

I had an idea today for establishing the breakpoint. On the character sheet, I could have a row of boxes for tracking damage independantly of descriptors. The way this would work is that every time you take damage to a descriptor, you mark off one box on the track for each point the descriptor was lowered. Each time you heal, you erase one marked box for each point the descriptor was healed.

You're mor or less tracking the total amount of damage sustained by the character. I could then establish a breakpoint for being "out" by altering the length of the row of boxes. PCs would have boxes of a certain length, while NPCs, extras, and so on would have boxes of varying length. Length would be defined by role in the story; PCs and major NPCs would have more boxes than lesser NPCs or extras.

[efindel]

You know I like raising issues, only to try to come up with answers for them later!  :-)
Here's an idea:

When a character loses a contest and has the total of the descriptors used in the contest drop below zero, the opponent can decide a special effect that happens to that character.  This can be anything that the opponent wants which is appropriate to the contest -- knocked out, mortally wounded, dead, loss of social standing, pukes guts out, whatever.  

This means those with zero or negative descriptors won't automatically be out -- they'll just be extremely easy to take out in a contest.

If you're still toying with the idea of having some kind of luck or plot points, you might want to allow the losing character's player to spend one in order to moderate the effect -- e.g., just be knocked out and badly wounded instead of dead.

A more complicated extension would be to have how bad the effect can be depend on how far down the descriptors have been knocked.  Hero Wars does something like this, though I can't remember the details at the moment.

Another idea would be to hinge things at -11 instead of zero, -11 being the point where it's no longer possible for the character to succeed at any task with that combination of descriptors (even a difficulty zero task).  Combined with the previous idea, you could have zero be the point where the opponent can specify a temporary special effect, and -11 be where permanent ones can be done.

[Paganini]

You know I like raising issues, only to try to come up with answers for them later!  :-)

Well, I already responded to this once, but the Forge seems to have eaten it. To sumarize, I like the idea, but it seems like it would need some sort of table of outcomes, especially if the outcome depends on the amount of negatives the character takes. That's somewhat contrary to the spirit of the game.

I guess I'll probably end up going with the -11 mechanic. Someone else already suggested something similar. It's probably the most logical way... it just seems inelegant to me.