Hero War Question for Sheshnela

[Nick the Nevermet]

Hiya,

I love HQ, but seeing how I missed the whole Glorantha boat up until I bought HQ, I get lost in the setting sometimes...

Anyhow, my specific question for right now: what is the hero war in Sheshnela about?  I see a kingdom that is about to be united by a king and a Church working together.  Not a perfect kingdom, but not significantly more than any other kingdom in Glorantha.  Not quite the same conflict as in Dragon Pass, or the War against War, or the internal whackiness of the Lunar Empire, etc.  I know I'm missing something, but have no idea what.  What's the Big Conflict in Sheshnela?  Thanks.

[newsalor]

IMO after they are done with their internal purges, that may or may not transform them into something horrific or beautiful, they will start cleansing the lands around them from heresy.

[newsalor]

IMO after they are done with their internal purges, that may or may not transform them into something horrific or beautiful, they will start cleansing the lands around them from heresy.

[Nick the Nevermet]

Hmm...

Certainly unification around a 'pure' ideology is a dangerous, dangerous thing.  So a Hero War based on the consequences of religious fanaticism are quite possible.

After getting some sleep, I guess I came up with some extra stuff.  First, everytime I read about Sheshnela, its always mentioned that the king & the Ecclesiarch are allied.  Its mentioned so often, I wonder if the Hero War starts with that breaking apart.  Maybe the Ecclesiarch announces venerating all saints including Garlant is heresy.  Maybe something happens with the Navigationalists.  The point is the whole 'One King, One Church, One Kingdom" motto starts to break down.


Second, I wonder how Seshnela relates to other nearby Hero War powder kegs, namely the Return of Arkat and the Kingdom of War.  I mean, Dragon Pass is going to suck the Lunars, Prax, the Orlanthi, and Harreck into a giant mushroom cloud.  I'm curious how those 'link-ups' may occur in the West.

After doing some digging online, I stumbled on some of the 'future history' of Dragon Pass (everything leading up to Argrath pulling down the Red Moon).  I realize that isn't necessarily cannon for HQ, but that is really got me wondering about the Hero Wars in the West.  Is there any similar statements about what's going to happen in the West?

I must admit that this thread is partially motivated by my inferiority complex when it comes to my understanding of Glorantha.  There's an amazing amount out there on it, ya know ;)

[Donald]

Hmm...

Second, I wonder how Seshnela relates to other nearby Hero War powder kegs, namely the Return of Arkat and the Kingdom of War.  I mean, Dragon Pass is going to suck the Lunars, Prax, the Orlanthi, and Harreck into a giant mushroom cloud.  I'm curious how those 'link-ups' may occur in the West.

I must admit that this thread is partially motivated by my inferiority complex when it comes to my understanding of Glorantha.  There's an amazing amount out there on it, ya know ;)

The only current canon on the subject is a few pages in "Glorantha Introduction to the Hero Wars" which gives no indication of a story arc. It does give pointers to likely conflicts though - the primary one being between the Rokari and Hrestoli churches. However there is also the Quinpolic League which, though Rokari, rejects the authority of the Seshnelan Ecclesiarch and some of his teachings. Then there are the Brithini, a race of immortal sorcerers. Basically you've got various groups all struggling to prove their superiority with religion as an excuse for land grabbing, massacres of heretics and pagans and anything else you want.

There is also a link to Dragon Pass, there are Rokari knights and missionaries in the Holy Country south of Dragon Pass where they are in conflict with the Aeolian church which is another variation of Malkioni church.

There's no reason for an inferiority complex though, the vast majority of the stuff on the web is fan writings which may or may not be reflected in the official version when it is eventually published.

[grbosch]

The West hasn't been very well developed in "official" publications, although several of the RQ era fanzines published stuff about it.  I'm no expert, but I was able to find some things that were published in the Genertela Book from the "Glorantha: Crucible of the Hero Wars" pack for RQIII.

According to that, the Hero Wars begin in Seshnela with an invasion of the Kingdom by armies from Safelster, Nolos, and Arolanit.  The gist of the piece is that Seshnela will be "divided, conquered and plundered."  Also, the Waertagi are going to return.  They will find lost Brithos and will ferry and army from Brithos to Arolanit.

So, the current unity and stability looks to be broken.  Bad for common folk, good for adventure RPGs!

You might be able to get more info from the Hero Wars mailing list on Yahoo:

http://groups.yahoo.com/group/HeroQuest-RPG/

or from the Glorantha Digest, which you can join at:

http://www.rpglist.org/mailman/listinfo/glorantha

(this last list is the grand-daddy of Gloranthan on-line discussion and is the home of the Ferocious Gloranthan Grognards ; )

Gerald

[Nick the Nevermet]

Thanks!

[Nils Weinander]

According to that, the Hero Wars begin in Seshnela with an invasion of the Kingdom by armies from Safelster, Nolos, and Arolanit.  The gist of the piece is that Seshnela will be "divided, conquered and plundered."  Also, the Waertagi are going to return.  They will find lost Brithos and will ferry and army from Brithos to Arolanit.

So, the current unity and stability looks to be broken.  Bad for common folk, good for adventure RPGs!

An excellent option. You could also make a case for an even stronger unity rising as a result of these attacks, turning Seshnela even more oppressive. In all making Seshnela an excellent place for bad guys and opponents.

[Invain]

According to that, the Hero Wars begin in Seshnela with an invasion of the Kingdom by armies from Safelster, Nolos, and Arolanit.  The gist of the piece is that Seshnela will be "divided, conquered and plundered."  Also, the Waertagi are going to return.  They will find lost Brithos and will ferry and army from Brithos to Arolanit.

My reading of the old Genertela book is pretty close to this, although I don't think the events described above mark the start of the Hero Wars in Seshnela - they take place later on, maybe around 1630. Most of the 1620's are taken up by the crusade to unify old Seshnela (including Nolos and Pasos) and purify its religion. Unfortunately for the King, many powerful people think a unified Seshnela is a very bad idea.

My reason for delaying the invasion until later is that other events have to happen first. At the start of the Hero Wars the Waertagi return and search the fog of Brithos. Many folks help out, and it is a big exciting quest that ends badly for everyone involved except for the Waertagi and Brithini - the two remaining original malkioni peoples (excluding the Vadeli). While this is going on, Safelster is wrapped up in its Five Arkats business. Once these two events have progressed a bit we can have the unified Waertagi-Brithini-Safelster invasion of a unified Seshnela. Remember that Arkat was origionally from Brithos, so my guess is that this connnection allows Safelster to join the "original Malkioni" club and participate in the invasion.

Just my 0.02 cents worth...

~Kevin McD

[Nick Brooke]

At the start of the Hero Wars the Waertagi return and search the fog of Brithos. Many folks help out, and it is a big exciting quest that ends badly for everyone involved except for the Waertagi and Brithini - the two remaining original malkioni peoples (excluding the Vadeli).

Here's my brief notes on the Brithini, Waertagi and Vadeli, the three Western Races. Anybody campaiging in Hero Wars era Seshnela is going to see more of all three of them than one might reasonably anticipate, given that all three are widely believed to be all-but-extinct at the start of the period...

Cheers, Nick

[Nick Brooke]

Most of the 1620's are taken up by the crusade to unify old Seshnela (including Nolos and Pasos) and purify its religion. Unfortunately for the King, many powerful people think a unified Seshnela is a very bad idea.

I'm a bit surprised we've got this far in the thread without spending more time on iconoclasm and the current Pope's drive to eradicate the age-old practice of venerating Malkioni saints. This "purify its religion" bit is going to be a real pain in the arse to pious Rokari everywhere who don't fit the "new" orthodoxy.

Also, Ph'nglui mgwl-nafh Zzabur Brithos wgah-nagl fhtagn!

Cheers, Nick

[keithn]

Also, Ph'nglui mgwl-nafh Zzabur Brithos wgah-nagl fhtagn!

Which translates as "excuse me Zzabur but have you just farted"

[Invain]

I'm a bit surprised we've got this far in the thread without spending more time on iconoclasm and the current Pope's drive to eradicate the age-old practice of venerating Malkioni saints. This "purify its religion" bit is going to be a real pain in the arse to pious Rokari everywhere who don't fit the "new" orthodoxy.

I agree totally. On reflection, Seshnela in the 1620s sounds like a pretty interesting place to game. HeroQuest says "In feudal Seshnela a mighty king and a powerful church work in tense cooperation to unite their land against foreigners, false gods, and heretics." The King is not only trying to reunite Seshnela, he is also bringing more land under the direct control of the crown. Ecclesiarch Theoblank is working to eliminate the veneration of saints (excluding Rokar, naturally) as well as any pagan practices. These two goals are not always compatible. The King might want to humble a pious noble, which the Ecclesiarch might oppose. The Ecclesiarch might want to punish a loyal vassal of the King for impiety. There are many possibilities for politics making strange bedfellows.

Also worth noting is that the veneration of saints, as well as more obviously pagan practices, are currently widespread in Seshnela. Just look at the "two-page spread" in HeroQuest! Imagine the peasant unrest that might occur when the ban on the Little Saints is enforced! "No more Strengthen Ale spells? No more Delicious Food feats? No more Break Fever talents?"

Sounds like fun to me. :)

~Kevin McD

[Alai]

I agree totally. On reflection, Seshnela in the 1620s sounds like a pretty interesting place to game. HeroQuest says "In feudal Seshnela a mighty king and a powerful church work in tense cooperation to unite their land against foreigners, false gods, and heretics." The King is not only trying to reunite Seshnela, he is also bringing more land under the direct control of the crown. Ecclesiarch Theoblank is working to eliminate the veneration of saints (excluding Rokar, naturally) as well as any pagan practices.

I'd agree that the major "what happens next in Seshnela" thread (at least that I can think of). But I reckon it's more in the category of, "What the Seshnegi elite _think_ the Hero Wars will be about", than the 'real' Hero Wars 'plot arc' for the region, which as alluded to earlier, a) happens significantly later on, and b) involves all sorts of Very Bad Stuff such the return of the Vadeli, Brithini, and Worse.

[Invain]

I'd agree thats the major "what happens next in Seshnela" thread (at least that I can think of). But I reckon it's more in the category of, "What the Seshnegi elite _think_ the Hero Wars will be about", than the 'real' Hero Wars 'plot arc' for the region, which as alluded to earlier, a) happens significantly later on, and b) involves all sorts of Very Bad Stuff such the return of the Vadeli, Brithini, and Worse.

I agree, for the most part. I would like to stress, though, that the political and spiritual struggle should not be underestimated. The Rokari don't even think the existence of the Saint Plane is OK according to Revealed Mythologies (p15). I believe the Ecclesiarch's quest to eliminate magical veneration will end up being fought in the Otherworlds.

Beyond that, there are all sorts of things that could be happening that we don't know about. Perhaps there will be a revival of the Serpent Kings, or the Vampire Kings, as a counter to the current powers. I will be very interested to see what the http://www.glorantha.com/products/1105.html">World of Glorantha or http://www.glorantha.com/products/1306.html">Heirs of Malkion books will say...

~Kevin McDonald