Forum changes: Editing of posts has been turned off until further notice.
Started by Walt Freitag, May 13, 2002, 05:31:28 PM
Quote from: contracycleQuote from: AndyGuestHmm, that to me suggests that there is no such thing as an entity/activity that is inherently a game, there are merely activities which may or may not be a game depending on the motivations of those involved ? Thats pretty much how I see it. IMO, there is a subset of games which exist for entertainment; this is what we conventionally refer to as "a game", something fairly trivial. But that, quite literally, is just the tip of the iceberg.
Quote from: AndyGuestHmm, that to me suggests that there is no such thing as an entity/activity that is inherently a game, there are merely activities which may or may not be a game depending on the motivations of those involved ?
QuoteHmm, that to me suggests that there is no such thing as an entity/activity that is inherently a game, there are merely activities which may or may not be a game depending on the motivations of those involved ?
QuoteBy your description golf isn't inherently a game,...
Quote...likewise if I choose to go to work for fun, without being paid, does it then become a game ?
QuoteAlso can the goal of a game not be the pleasure of playing ? When I take part in sport (a rare occurence) I am just there for fun, I don't care if I win or lose, taking part is what matters (bleagh that sounds sickening but its true), the only thing that spoils my fun is people taking the sport too seriously and getting upset about it. So for me a game doesn't require a goal in terms of an end-point, the game itself can be the goal.
QuoteTo clarify: When I pick up a box of Monoploy, any definition of "game" is going to have to include the idea that Monopoly is a game even if I'm not current playing it. This idea that if I don't play Monopoly with a certain intent, despite following all the rules, it ceases to be a game (like if, for some reason, playing it is part of my job and I don't like playing Monopoly) does not sit well with me. It's pulling in an element that wasn't in there before. Rather than nailing down the definition and making it more specific for the purpose of discusion, by pulling in intent, it broadens games into some areas where it previously was not, while excluding other things that were previously included. This does not strike me as useful.
QuoteAlso, it strikes me as counterintiutive that two people could be engaging in the game activity, and it's a game for one of them and not for the other. I'm playing chess to get Bob's money, so it's not a game for me. Bob is playing because he likes the challenge, and the money is secondary to him. So it's game.
QuoteSo, considered from a more objective perspective, is it a game or not? Does one person not treating it as a game turn it into a mere "activity"? Or does at least one person treating it as a game make it into a game?
QuoteNormal form vs. extensive form game: In normal (or strategic) form games, the players move (choose their actions) simultaneously. Whenever the strategy spaces of the players are discrete (and finite), the game can be represented compactly as an NxM-game (see below). By contrast, a game in extensive form specifies the complete order of moves (along the direction of time), typically in a game tree (see below), in addition to the complete list of payoffs and the available information at each point in time and under each contingency. As any normal form can be 'inflated' to an extensive form game, concepts of strategic equilibrium in general relate to extensive form games. Whenever the exact timing of actions is irrelevant to the payoffs, however, a game is represented with more parsimony in normal form.
Quote from: contracycleI was trying to think of a response to "so what use is this broader concept of game" question over the weekend, and came up with this - the worlds fist (AFAIK) RPG for real money.
Quote from: wfreitagAm I the only old school gamer who remembers "money dungeons?" They might have been a very short-lived (early 80s) and/or very local (mid-Atlantic) phenomenon at game cons. You paid a steep entry fee to play, and you got to keep any treasure your character gained, converted one for one from gold pieces to dollars.