What is Shattered Vistas?

[Willow]

What is Shattered Vistas?

Shattered Vistas is a game about life.  Life that sucks hard and is an uphill battle, possibly filled with eldritch horrors and ninjas.

In Shattered Vistas, reality is *broken*.  The world’s ended, it’s up to you to clean up the mess, or at least hold things off as long as you can.  The Vistas are a dark place, and they get a little worse every day.

As a hero, you go into dungeons, kill things, and take their stuff.  But its more than that.  The things that you fight are bound into the fate of the world.  The more you confront monsters in dark caves, the more you confront intrinsic laws that govern life and bind everyone into misery.  Can you throw everything away for the sake of others?

As a player, you have hardcore resource management options.  Think the hidden combat orders of Burning Wheel or Diplomacy combined with blind bidding and lists of kewl powers.  Also buckets of dice.  I love me some rolling of buckets of dice.

Two questions:

Does this appeal to you?

Is there anything that seems particularly problematic?

[James Holloway]

It sounds like you have a clear vision of the game's color (desperate struggle in the face of encroaching chaos), mechanical stuff, and central activity of play (mission-based dungeon scenarios linked by a sort of gunslinger/Delta-Green moral question). All this is very good.

As far as whether or not anything seems like a problem, more detail on the system and how it informs a session of play would really be needed. Can you give us the executive summary?

[baron samedi]

Willow,

A question: If the characters know their pilfering destroys the world, why do they engage it in?

Your premise reminds me a bit of  "Power Kill ", the editorial-disguised-as-a-game by John Tynes within the Puppetland RPG. I may be wrong...

Regards,

Erick

[Willow]

Erick-

I may have misrepresented my setting by putting a quick joke in there.

One of the points of the setting is that life sucks, and the world is out to get you.  It's easy to fight the obvious stuff:  go into the dragon's lair, kill it (and because it's there), take it's stuff.  After a certain point, you have to get into dealing with corruption among humans and among the fabric of reality.  Pilfering ancient ruins (at least at first) does indeed make the world a better place, but there comes a time when you have to move on.

So no, this isn't supposed to be satire.

James-

The game's in a very alpha stage, but let me give you a basic rundown of the mechanics.

Each player is going to have a variety of stats, power-ups that give bonuses to certain types of things, specific combat maneuvers, and some magic spells.  I'm looking at a D&D or Burning Wheel level of character depth.  Every character has at least two Reserves, which are basically pools of dice: an Effort Reserve (for things where the character is really pushing themselves to succeed), and a Fate Reserve (for things where the character is getting a lucky break from the universe.)  Other types of character-specific reserves are possible: a really strong character might have a Strength Reserve.

The GM has a Dharma level and a Kharma reserve.  For basic tasks like 'do I get past the trapped door?' SV uses a very tasky resolution- it's an opposed roll between the player, and the GM's Dharma level.  If the GM wants to make the door harder to get past, he has to spend Kharma.  For conflicts against characters, conflict is round by round, and the NPC will have a character sheet, but not reserves of its own- those have to come from the GM's Kharma.

The ideal framework of play is Figure Out the Problem, Find the Problem, Kill the Problem (and take its stuff), all the while encountering minions/obstacles along the way and having to make hard choices about how to spend one's resources.

[baron samedi]

Hi Willow,

I think I get your general idea: the PCs therein engage in "Problem-Solving Adventures", right?

About your premise, I was simply curious on how your vision reconciled these two elements:

1) "Repairing the broken universe", i.e. heroic self-sacrifice for the whole.
2) Engaging in the "Holy Trinity" of pilfering (corridor-monster-treasure), i.e. amoral looting.

Unless I'm wrong again, from this layman's eyes these two seem at odds... In what way would the PCs be motivated to do both?

Is this contradiction the focus of your game's premise, e.g. "How can I choose between saving the world for everyone's long-term advantage and pilfering it for my short-term advantage?" Say, like the "rogue with a golden heart" Han Solo in Star Wars IV, who finally chooses heroic rebellion over mercenary life? It'd be interesting to see contradictory reward mechanics corresponding to those... a smaller, short term reward for pilfering and a longer to have, bigger for moral action... Just an idea.

Cheers,

Erick

[Mike Holmes]

Is this the same game I read and posted about on indieunderground?

Mike

[Willow]

Erick- I guess we just don't see things the same way.  I agree that that's an interesting idea there, but it's not really what I'm going for.

Mike- Yep.  More or less.

[Mike Holmes]

A link to those discussions we had could get some people fast-forwarded to where they could give better advice, Willow.

Or do you think that your ideas there are out of date?

Mike

[coffeestain]

Mike,

Unfortunately, the site suffered some back end issues and is no longer available.

Regards,
Daniel

[Joshua A.C. Newman]

But its more than that.  The things that you fight are bound into the fate of the world.  The more you confront monsters in dark caves, the more you confront intrinsic laws that govern life and bind everyone into misery.  Can you throw everything away for the sake of others?

Willow, that question  is impossible to ask and answer given the rules you're hinting at. It's not  good color; it's just a distraction that, if followed, will lead to suboptimal play.

Here's your text with that edited out:

What is Shattered Vistas?

Shattered Vistas is a game about exploring dungeons, killing things, and taking their stuff. Life that sucks hard and is an uphill battle, possibly filled with eldritch horrors and ninjas.

In Shattered Vistas, reality is *broken*. The world’s ended. The Vistas are a dark place, and they get a little worse every day.

 As a hero, you go into dungeons, kill things, and take their stuff.

 As a player, you have hardcore resource management options. Think the hidden combat orders of Burning Wheel or Diplomacy combined with blind bidding and lists of kewl powers. Also buckets of dice. I love me some rolling of buckets of dice.

OK, so what I see here is a tactical game where KTaTTS is the road to success, right? And casual disregard for the consequences is encouraged? (There's nothing wrong with that at all. See Conan for an entertaining and exciting model of this, or Dying Earth for a funny moral take on it.) Play is done through blind bidding where you increase the likelihood of success by bringing more dice into play. There is no strategic level of play (e.g. optimal character building).

Is this a correct characterization? What have I misunderstood? What haven't you explained?

[baron samedi]

Hi Willow,

I think Joshua has just expressed very clearly the exact oxymoronic interrogation that I tried miserably to convey with my earlier question in this thread. (That's what I meant by wondering about the two "opposite premises" of "heroic deeds" vs "amoral looting", from a rules angle, not implying that any of them isn't fun.)

[Josh Roby]

Yeah, Joshua got to it before I did.  I'm going to say it in stronger words, though.

Over on story-games, you said this:

The game is primarily about the game itself, the resource management, the conflict system, and resolution.  I'm approaching it from a primarily Gamist standpoint, but there's some chrome that seeps in along the edges (setting and color).

Which makes your present ad copy pretty much bullshit. Shattered Vistas is not about life, it is not about sacrifice.  What you've got above in the OP is a high-gloss snowjob.  You need to ditch this ad copy, and quickly.  Because if I bought your book expecting to get game about life, broken reality, and sacrifice and instead I got some resource-shifting game rewarding cleverness and tactical finesse, I'd be pissed.  Your ad copy cannot be a broken promise.  That's the quick route to the trashcan.

If the game is about clever use of tactics and resources, say that.

[Joshua A.C. Newman]

I thought I was supposed to be Bad Cop! We gotta get this straight!

Willow, (What's your real name?) write down, without any need to convince anyone of anything, what your game is and does. Let's go from there.

[Willow]

Ouch.  Harsh but fair.  I have to mull this over.

And actually, Willow *is* my real name.

[Joshua A.C. Newman]

Ouch.  Harsh but fair.  I have to mull this over.

Yeah, but don't ditch on the idea. There's something here you want to do. Josh and I are being incisive because that's what this forum is for: to sharpen your ideas into a finely constructed tool that does precisely what you want.

And actually, Willow *is* my real name.

Awesome!