[MLwM/DitV] Getting away from Pawn Stance

[5niper9]

This will be a combined Actual Play report, because we had problems with both of these systems when we started playing them.

Br. Jack(David)
He had a complicated history and were the former member of a gang of bandits. After they attacked a Dog and everybody except him were killed he converted to the faith.
Accomplishment: I can out-shoot my instructor. (Won)

Br. Jacob(Edwin)
He came from a mountain people background. He was raised by a family in the faith.
Accomplishment: I feel accepted. (Won)

Sr. Mary Clarence<

[Christoph Boeckle]

Hiya!

I had a similar question some time ago. I think the answer is to be found in retrospect: was there anybody dissatisfied with the raise? (I'm paraphrasing p.77-78 of revised edition.)
From my vantage point, your raise seems rock solid. It's extremely credible (this situation and these characters could easily have ended up in a mess!) and definitely to the point regarding the town. That's the kind of raise that'll really make me think and weigh it out against the stakes.

Regarding MLwM, it's difficult to tell. Perhaps you need to give it another chance like you did with DitV?
One quick general thing I'd say about playing the master for an obliging minion is that you should never praise that minion. The game is about shitty relationships, not partners-in-crime.

[ironick]

As far as I know, having her lose the child is a legitimate raise.  Raises and sees are used to determine who wins the stakes and how--they don't always have to deal directly with the stakes themselves.  That being said, I think it would have been more dramatic to initiate a follow-up conflict to determine whether or not she did indeed lose the baby due to her injury, but that's just me.

As far as pawn stance goes, I don't have much of an idea for you.  During the one DitV campaign I played in, I don't think any of us really felt that way at all about our characters--it was immersion all the way for about three hours every time.

Nick

[Andrew Cooper]

"She looses the child." is an awesome raise.  Notice the player gave and saved the child.  This is what Dogs is all about.  The player probably could have continued to See and Raise and most likely won the stakes but he was unwilling to see the unborn child die in order to do so.  Perfect. Those are the types of decisions players are supposed to make in Dogs.