Steal this pdf! (possible business model)

[guildofblades]

Are we 100% sure the ads can't be imbedded into PDF files.

I've talked to a couple of folks who seem sure it can be done, though I lack the knowledge how to myself. Couldn't find anything else on the internet about post distributed ads in PDFs though.

Ryan S. Johnson
Guild of Blades Publishing Group
http://www.guildofblades.com
http://www.1483online.com
http://www.thermopylae-online.com

[David Artman]

Well, sure, you can embed an ad prior to distillation; you can put nearly any kind of image or text content in at that point.

The issue is whether it's *active* content which changes each time the book is opened (or each page turn!) while there's an internet connection. The idea is to actually generate revenue from ad views and click-throughs from unique IPs. Ad revolvers pay for unique IP ad views; otherwise, someone could setup a script on a server which just pinged ads over and over again, and accumulate huge income for "nothing." That's the "problem" with doing the Distillation server-side, on the fly, pulling in a "fresh" ad each time someone buys the PDF: the server will still be a single IP address, and thus worth little to nothing in terms of revolver payments.

Of course... this brings back the question of "Why not just make it normal HTML, online only?" OK, sure, you can do that (trivially) but it's not *quite* like having a PDF; for example, you don't have total control over presentation, with HTML, due to browser customizations or individual style sheet overrides. And there's no offline viewing (which, yeah, wouldn't generate revenue; but that wouldn't be very often, I'd think, in this day of ubiquitous Internet connections and wireless everywhere).

Anyhow... if someone can figure a way to do it within PDF, I'm all ears. But this other thing being discussed (DNL) seems to be hot for not only active content (ads) but for constant updating (revisions, bonus content) and for follow-on sales (try before buy; supplements updated straight into the PDF). It sounds really, really great for small publishers seeking new revenue channels.

David

[guildofblades]

I guess the question becomes can anyone open and use a DNL formatted file without any need of an additional piece of software?

One of the reasons PDF is so accepted now is its got adobe behind pushing the free PDF viewers and its got several years of traction in the market place.

Well, just talked with our programmer again about this issue and he's going to take a fresh look at actively trying to serve ads into a PDF. From what I have seen there seems to be options at putting active javascript into a PDF, which should in theory enable us to load in an HTML or PHP file which is the host to the script that serves the image. That should enable the rich media ad to both detect the unique IP address and show the ad as being served from a specific domain, which is often also a limiting factor when serving ads. Ads tend to need to be served from approved root domains.

Alternatively, my programmer assures me we can make downloadable self contained .msi or .exe programs that open, formatted with a print ready html layout, which then can contain the ads. So that might another option we might pursue, but PDFs would still be better.

Ryan S. Johnson
Guild of Blades Publishing Group
http://www.guildofblades.com
http://www.1483online.com
http://www.thermopylae-online.com

[Seth M. Drebitko]

  DNL does offer its viewer for free as a download, and from what I have heard their software also tends to save files in a very small format as well.

  Right now my only problem I am having with the idea is that while I have been in communication with the company and they have answered every question I have had thus far they skirt the issue of licensing every time it is brought up. Right now we are going to try and actually get our main site up and running at which point we are hoping Dnaml actually being able to see our design might get them onboard.
  If we can not get Dnaml to allow us to license online control panel versions of their software, we are looking at our only option being to create, or obtain a variant of the software. I would say given we at the moment do not entirely have the technical skill, nor connections to attempt such a daring task as backwards engineering their software, this project may be a long term goal.
  I need to think and plan out more strongly what we are going to do as either path will require a great investment of time and money. Once I have more information on our plans I will certainly hit every one back on the status. I would also be interested in discussing alternatives to the issue, and anything else related.
Regards, Seth

[guildofblades]

Well, I know that a program can be written. A .exe or .msi. Our 1483 Online software thats running right now was coded in Visual basic and uses .Net technology for the online elments. When players are in the program the program simply imports the IE browser inside itself and we can display web pages. When a player is playing the game and moves from the web pages portion to the map function, the map is done in VB and shoved into a partial screen "container" and then the advertisement and graphics are left to run in a browser container.

We could just as easily make a VB program that puts a PDF into the primary container, which can then scroll, then use top and bottom smaller contains to shove browser features and our web ads. We could make the PDF pages in the central container to be formatted to be print ready to a normal sheet size. But I think the problem with this approach would be the primary container would both scroll down and right within the screen for viewing online, which would be less than ideal for online display.

Now, perhaps a better option would simply be to make a HTML version of the content that displays through a simple VB program run through a .exe and see if there is a means where we can give the user to use the program to export a printable PDF. They'll be sure to read most of it in an online version before moving to export a printable PDF. I could lock the text on the PDF too to make the html view have more utility value even after export. Hm.

Ryan S. Johnson
Guild of Blades Publishing Group
http://www.guildofblades.com
http://www.1483online.com
http://www.thermopylae-online.com