Thoughts on a 'see-saw' or 'push-pull' Magic system

[opsneakie]

I wasn't actually going to use sleeping as a refresher, exactly because of the sleepy mage syndrome. There would probably be some other way to deal with refreshment that was a little harder to do.

[Adam Riemenschneider]

This is pretty damn cool. Kudos.

I've got 2 thoughts/questions/suggestions. First one:

If you are a Fire7/Water3 mage, this is your "natural" state, correct? So if you cast some Fire and end up at 5/5, will you ever get back to your own natural 7/3 balance, *without* casting some water?

I was thinking that if I was a twinked out Fire mage, I might only really have skill in casting Fire. I might have simply neglected learning any of that wimpy Water stuff. Will time correct this imbalance? Or am I just stuck with needing to water the lawn for the afternoon?

How about other methods to correct this Fire/Water imbalance? Is there anything non-magical he can do to boost his Fire back up? Since you appear to already have married the elements to emotional states, could my Fire guy get more points by getting into arguments, starting fights, or otherwise exposing himself to that which Fire represents in your world?

Second one:

Chaos/Order being its own thing. This is pretty rocking, too. If Fire/Water, Earth/Air both exist on the "x" axis, and Chaos/Order is on the "y" axis of things, it's possible to cast an Order-based Fire spell, just as it's possible to cast a Chaos-based Fire spell? So the Order one gives set results (range, duration, power), and the Chaos one is all random, but quite likely more powerful, in the end result?

If I'm following you correctly, I think you're really on to something, here. Please, keep it up!

-a-

[opsneakie]

You're following exactly here, Adam. I'm thinking there would be some other ways to re-balance yourself, some non-magical means. The question is, do you refresh by following that element or by doing the opposite?

i.e. does exposing yourself to what Fire represents in the world increase your fire because you're acting on it, or decrease it because you're expending the Fire energy within you? Do you have to take a moment to sit back and think to 'refresh' the opposite abilities?

This is something I'm still not sure on. I kind of like the idea that you have to refresh by doing something that's not necessarily normal for you, so a fighter would have to take a step back from continuous battle to get his points back.

Good to know at least a couple people like the idea.

- John

[Adam Riemenschneider]

(I'm having a heck of a time writing this one)

To get further into this, you have to answer the following:

Do I (A) "make room" for the Fire by spending Water, or do I (B) grab Fire and push it into my container, and thereby force the Water to leave?

The question applies to both casting magic, and for regaining elemental energy via non-magical means. Explain to me why magic works in your world. When I do Fire magic, what's going on?

Possibilities and Ramifications

(A):
I cast a Fire spell in order to light a candle. I am *spending Water* to make a fire happen. If I reach Fire 10/Water 0, I can't cast any more Fire, because I am *out* of Water.
To refill my capacity to do more Fire, I have to *spend Fire,* through either magical or non-magical means.

(B):
I cast a Fire spell in order to light a candle. I am *spending Fire* to make fire happen. If I reach Fire 0/Water 10, I can't cast any more Fire, because I am *out* of Fire.
To refill my capacity to do more Fire, I have to *get more Fire,* through either magical or non-magical means.

Personally, I think (B) makes more sense. I also think that refilling Fire via non-magical means will be easier to wrap your (and your players') head around, than trying to figure out what expending Water via non-magical means would look like. I can conceive, quite readily, what going out and "getting Fire" would play out like. You'd go and do, or at least be around, the qualities that Fire has. I also like this because it approaches my understanding of occult/magical thinking, where like attracts like, and energy flows through association.

The idea of (A), where I have to *spend Fire* via non-magical means, is difficult to wrap around. How do I do this? What does it look like, and play out like? You *could* say that by doing Fire things, I am getting Fire "out of my system," and am thereby spending it.... I dunno.

-a-

[opsneakie]

It works like option (B) you presented, although points won't be spent for every spell. You cast a powerful Fire spell, and you spend fire, until eventually you run out of Fire and can no longer use Fire magic of any kind until you refresh it. I'm not sure quite what you'll do to refresh the pools yet, but I'm getting there. I'm hoping to have at least a preliminary set of rules done by the end of the week, so I can do some playtests soon.

[blodwin]

  Hi,
     Just came across your post, Amazed at the idea, very simple and very close to some ideas I have been kicking around.
Which might help or just create diversions? Any way here goes:

Your idea could be one of many ways to cast magic or use abilities! The choice depends on the player and his characters learning process? i.e. we start life as hotheaded individuals on a journey to wisdom, for some!
 
The law of your system relies on transference of balance between fixed opposites at character generation.
The way of Transference magic. Method 1.

1.  A method of using magic called (Transference) but used by those who run the risk of its effects, which you have covered.
Or
2.  A method combining the elements called (Harmonic) which has a less damaging effect? But would bring a balanced reduction of both opposites.

What I am trying to point out is, are you trying to accomplish what I am trying to accomplish a gaming experience, which gives feed back on the way, you use your character? Then with this feedback your character can learn what suits him/her.

The dice and the methods we could talk about but what do thick so far!

Blodwin.