[Gen Con Oz 2008] Suggestions for games

[Peril Planet]

Hey, there is a small contingent of people going to the first Gen Con Oz to run something akin to Games on Demand.  We will be running games for an Australian public that has limited exposure to indie games.  While I will be bringing the games I really love, as will the other people involved, I was wanting suggestions for "must have" games to showcase - the games that really epitomise what the "indie game scene" is about or that have had an influence on the "culture" of indie game design.

What I am after is your suggestions for games to include and (most importantly) why you think they should be included on the "menu" of games that people will be able to try.  I have my own ideas on what should be included, but I want to hear yours first.

What I am after is a broad list of what is or was important, influention, fun, exciting, cool or hot.  Then we can narrow it down to a manageable list and see what (if any) gaps are in the list of games we are taking to Brisbane.  From there I can track down any I don't have and play some practice games.

Your suggestions will be invaluable!

-Nathan

[Peril Planet]

Okay, so here are some thoughts to get people started.  They are vague, off the top of my head and very rough.  I have played some of them and not others.

Dogs in the Vinyard - strong mechanics that tie very well with the setting.  Very popular game.
My Life With Master - lots of critical acclaim and an amazing game with a great sense of mood and purpose. 
Spirit of the Century - pulp action with a set of rules that really do capture the spirit of the genre.  This game takes an already good and uses them to fulfil a specific purpose well.
Sorcerer - one of the early (the earliest?) indie games to find a popular audience.  Great example of narrativist style game.

Are my comments too weak or strong for the games mentioned?  Do you agree or disagree with them?  Are they the kinds of games that you would share with people that have just wandered in from buying 4th Ed D&D or playing Yu-Gi-Oh all morning?  Don't be shy.  Or are you telling me that there are no games you think are worth showing to people unaware or unfamiliar with indie games, or wanting to try somthing new? 

Come on.  Share.  Just tell me your all-time or current favourite game and what makes it so.

- Nathan

[Ron Edwards]

Hey Nathan,

I've been struggling with how to answer this, and I guess it comes down to a couple of logistic issues I need to understand.

What sort of venue are we talking about, both in locale and in terms of available time? That breaks down into ...

- the opportunity for play - are there lots and lots of people who will be playing with one another based on signing up?
- is it occurring in a dedicated play space? what's that like?
- is it during the evening or during the day, or rather, is play competing with other events?
- how long are the sessions? how many people (minimum, maximum)?
- is it even this organized? or are you talking about pick-up games for which all of the above are defined on the spot?

With a stronger grasp of what's happening physically and socially, I think I could make some comments about the games you've chosen and also suggest others.

As a couple of minor comments:

1. Please don't describe Sorcerer or, probably, any other game as "narrative style." It conveys the message that play, and specifically resolution, is composed of free-form talking. That will turn off people who don't like that stuff, and the game itself will turn off the people who do, which is pretty much lose-lose.

2. I think you're missing a word in the Spirit of the Century blurb. I'm mentioning it in case you cut-and-pasted.

Best, Ron

[Eero Tuovinen]

I'm rather hesitant to go into this kind of listing on the basis of some kind of fan affection, but looking at it practically on the basis of my own experiences at demonstrating and selling indie games is possible. I also suspect that these considerations are not really central when discussing actual and immediate play - lists of seminal works are more useful for discussion than play, as most folks can't just go and play 20 important games one after another. With that in mind, some suggestions:

Dead of Night
Dogs in the Vineyard
Dust Devils
InSpectres
My Life with Master
Polaris
Primetime Adventures
Sorcerer
The Mountain Witch
Universalis

The above games are hand-picked for significance, variety, popularity and optimum demonstrability in short demos. They are what I might take with me for a similar purpose, if I were limited to ten games (although I'd probably give a different answer if you asked me again tomorrow; there are just so many good games available). If demonstrability weren't an issue I'd include some other stuff as well (TSOY, Burning Wheel, Multiverser, to name a few), and if the number of titles weren't a problem, I'd just grab the Arkenstone inventory with me

Also, about Sorcerer - it's not really "the earliest indie game" for any meaning of indie outside some self-fulfilling "indie is what Ron Edwards does" definition. When I describe Sorcerer's influential position, I usually concentrate on its seminal role in the Forge design subculture and the new kind of cottage industry model Ron advocates and successfully demonstrates with the game.

[Peril Planet]

I agree with all comments!  Ron, my apologies for the narrativist tag – if I was pitching the game to a prospective player I would talk about what it is about, the characters you play, what you do and how you do it and the game is cool, that kind of thing (as I would for any game).  Eero, I agree with what you say about Sorcerer not being the "earliest" – I knew that comment would cause a stir!

Anyway, the intention of the previous post was to provoke responses.  Thanks.  Now, more details;

-  The event is registered through Gen Con and players can either pre-register or drop -in with their "generic tickets".  GM's will be running for groups, though there is no minimum number of participants (and I am not sure of the maximum).
-  The event consists of three tables and GM's and will take place in the same location and at the same time as other registered rpg events.  There will be two days of games, with three sessions per day;

10am – 12noon
1pm – 5pm
6pm – 10pm
(with all three tables and GMs available each session)

Players will be offered a "menu" of games that the GM is able / willing to run and the group decides what they wish to play.  It may occur that there are only enough players for a single table to run, or a lack of consensus so that several tables run with just a couple of players each.  Heck, the entire event may consist of just the GMs playing games with each other for the whole weekend!  As this is the first Gen Con in Australia and the first time that all the GM's will have met and run an event like this, we have no idea (or expectations) on what demand will be like.  We are going along with a bunch of games tucked under our arm and the intention of having fun and sharing a bit of passion with others.  We will play it fast and loose and see what the big GM in the sky throws at us!

Eero, I agree with your comment on the list of seminal work – with only five GM's we wouldn't be able to demo all the cool, interesting and significant games out there, even if we could lock players into 20 consecutive sessions!  What I was after was the kind of thing you have provided – your list contains several games that will be represented, and a couple I had not considered.  Perhaps I need to revise my original question;

If you were going to GM in this event (described above) and could only bring 5 or 10 games to demo, what would they be?  Why this selection – is it because of the variety, the ease of running games in the time available, their significance, or just because they are cool?

It is not my intention to create a list of the "best" games to demo – nooo way!  We already have a bunch of games that we are taking to Brisbane, based on personal preferences and what we know.  I wanted to "open the floor" to others to get their ideas.

Thanks for your comments already,
Nathan

[Ron Edwards]

Thanks Nathan! One thing that strikes me is that a given session may have a certain amount of slush time as people show up, join in, mill around, decide whether to stay or to run off to the kewl-ass New Hot Game starting at the next table, or whatever. That makes the two-hour session problematic, and I suggest using the quickest, smack-em-go games in that slot.

I'll have to think a bit about the possible picks. If I do it now, I'll probably smack my head and curse for forgetting something, right in the middle of the night.

Best, Ron

[Peril Planet]

a given session may have a certain amount of slush time... and I suggest using the quickest, smack-em-go games in that slot.

I agree entirely, and was surprised when I saw that short timeslot.  Perhaps I will tune up an ultra-fine super-quick demo of Space Rat, maybe a "Catch the Rat" type romp!

[Andrew Smith]

Thanks Nathan! One thing that strikes me is that a given session may have a certain amount of slush time as people show up, join in, mill around, decide whether to stay or to run off to the kewl-ass New Hot Game starting at the next table, or whatever. That makes the two-hour session problematic, and I suggest using the quickest, smack-em-go games in that slot.

Absolutely.  The other option is to play a series of short demos in that slot with a view to attracting people back for later sessions, but the simple, punchy, action games can be great in a short timeslot.