The Worm Ridden Cave - A Chthonian adventure

[rabidchyld]

Sunday night we finally played Chthonian!!  I had been having problems ttrying to get everyone in one place to play, so I finally just grabbed hubby and neighbor and declared Chthonian for the night.  Since there were only 2 players, and the ever-lovable NPC Vyvyan, I wasn't sure how it was going to go, and whether or not they would enjoy it.  

Actually, it was much more intense than the last time around, which I will put a link to later.  (Little time right now...gotta get to work...I will edit this afternoon)

The characters this time were Charley, the LARP gamer, and Mark, the karate club guy, and of course, Vyvyan, the rough and tumbly punk.  

Since I'm so short on time now, but I really want to get this down, I'm just going to do the quick and nasty run through, with more details later.  

They went on a caving trip for geology class, and were separated into groups of 3 to explore a cave and find certain formations and such.  The pc's found a patch of purple slime when Charley slipped and fell on it.  They took note and moved on.  

Then they found the dead body, which Charley tripped over and fell.  As they investigated, the body attacked them, and Mark made quick work of it with his tiger claw karate action, ripping it's throat out.  At the same time, though, Charley was grabbed by it and had his leg clawed from all the jostling of Mark.  A seething mass of worms crawled out of it's throat, and Mark decided to get a sample and put it in his water bottle.  

After a while, they found a puppy trapped in a crevasse, which they rescued and carried with them, only to have it violently expire in their arms later.  Since Mark has an intense fear of dogs, Charley put the dog back into a crevasse and while he was doing that, they were attacked by 3 horrible worm dogs.  Mark and Vyvyan took care of them, with minimal damage to Charley.  Ye gods, Charley just got the crap beat out of him this time.  

They were getting ready to head out of the cave, when they heard a girl from their class scream from deeper into the cave.  They moved to investigate and found the mounds of worm ridden mulch, seething and moving.  Disturbed by this, they moved quickly through the passage and heard a weird chanting.  They followed the voice and ended up in a cavern, lit by kerosene lanterns, with a disgusting cultist chanting.  He had worms crawling under his skin and into his eyes.  Charley grabbed one of the lamps and tried to attack him, but missed and shattered it on the cave wall, burning himself in the process.  Yet again, Mark fought the guy, until he turned into a worm monster thing, with his arms, legs, and neck extended by worms.  They knocked the worms out of his torso and his body fell in half.  His torso, carried by the worms, scuttled off into a small tunnel, leaving a trail of slime and worms.  

They followed him through the slime and came into a very large cavern, with the worm entity phasing in and out of this reality, half of the cultist, who had begun chanting again, and the girl from their class unconscious on a rock.  The final battle ensued.  Charley managed to burn the cultist and stopped his chanting, which pissed off the worm thing.  It grabbed him and wrapped a tentacle around him and began phasing out of this plane.  They managed to get Charley away and the girl to safety, then began the battle against the worm thing again.  Vyvyan attacked with his flashlight, only to get his whole arm stuck and the worm started phasing out again with Vyvyan.  Charley pulled Vyvyan free, while Mark did an all out attack on it, which finally defeated the worm and it disappeared, leaving a rain of small worms and purple slime.  

At the end, Charley was bleeding and crazy, and the other 2 were just bleeding.  He went and bought a scrapbook to put his evidence in from this trip...a couple of pictures taken of the dead body and the worms, and also from the package they had received before the trip.  It contained evidence of their last adventure and a videotape of Vyvyan being attacked.  

That's pretty much what happened in the game.  I'll post more later about some other things that happened and comments.  

melodie

[Ron Edwards]

Hi Melodie,

Worm dogs? Ewww!

I think what interests me about Cthonian is the experience of play that communicates itself in posts about it - somehow, it's not Cthulhu-lite, it's something else, in actual moment-to-moment terms. Not having played it, I'm having a hard time pinning that down. If I'm actually making sense, and not vaguely groping in non-Euclidean angles, can you articulate whatever it is I'm perceiving?

Best,
Ron

[rabidchyld]

Hi Ron,

Worm dogs...three of them all dead and in various stages of decay, yet somehow alive.  They are held together by masses of writhing, ropy worms that you can see through the peeling skin.  One of them is just a head and legs held together by worms in the middle and you can see them falling off as the dog approaches...mua-ha-ha!!!

I think I might be able to articulate the difference.  In COC, you spend a lot of time investigating mysterious, undescribable monsters, or chasing after cultists.  There are times when you don't get into a combat situation at all, and when you do you just die.  It can be very frustrating spending hours of game time investigating every little detail, only to be attacked by some hideous creature and get your head chomped off without accomplishing anything.  

In Chthonian, however, there is less investigation, and what there is of it is more ...proactive? maybe is the word...  not sure here, but it plays more like a video game.  The whole point is tension and release and keeping the action flowing.  The clues are a little more obvious because the game isn't really centered around investigation as much as action.  

Also, the descriptions of the monsters are very clear and ugly, which isn't the case as often in COC.   They just don't have sick puppies like Zak working for them (hee!).  That really adds to the game as far as I'm concerned.  You have something very icky in your face and you know it.  

There are a couple of issues that came out in game, though, that I would like to put down here.  These are things that my players brought up:  

My group didn't really get the whole idea of having 3 combat stats.  They felt they were too ambiguous, and only ended up using one of their fight stats during the game.  They also mentioned the lack of a defense stat.  

Failed rolls:  there were a couple of times when there was a failed roll but it really wasn't appropriate to assign damage.  Like when Charley threw a rock at the worm guy and failed the roll.  He made sure to point out that he was far enough away to aviod damage, but then he failed..and he didn't think it was appropriate for me to give damage when he was not in range of anything at the time.   He felt like the system doesn't reward players for having good ideas that keep them out of combat, or for working together as a group.  I couldn't really pinpoint that one, though.  I'll ask for an example on that.

sanity checks:  Making the sanity check after the first combat rolls kinda interrupts the flow of combat.  My group were kinda jolted when I told them to make a sanity check while they were busy trying to figure out what to do next.  I don't really know what to do about this except make it more like the fight or flight instinct.  Fight whatever icky thing is in front of you and then afterwards roll sanity...when it's all over and you realize just what it was that came after you.  

Also in the realm of sanity:  rolling to gain sanity back is a good thing, but being able to get rid of an attitude they just got kinda confused them.  They were of the opinion that if you get a fear of worms because you got attacked by a huge worm from another dimension a minute ago, you don't just "get over it" by the end of the day.   At the same time, though, they don't want a huge list of attitudes.  The best way to fix this may be to roll to get rid of attitudes at the beginning of the next game or something, I don't know.  

The use of magic:  you know this one would come up again, mainly because of the cultist chanting and summoning up a monster from another dimension.  If it's good for the cultist, it should be good for them, too.  They want some kind of...maybe..lore skill or something..to be able to use.  Even if it starts at 0 or 1, they could still find the book that the cultist is using and defeat the monster that way instead of beating it with a flashlight or something.  Or if their skill is really low they could screw it up really bad and invite some other kind of monster.  Oh, the fun we could have with that....

I got an ear full last night after the game.  They really loved it, and were on the edge of their seats the whole time, but at the end just came out with all this stuff I wasn't expecting.  The only concern I have is that the formula for deciding how many successes it takes to defeat a monster doesn't really work with 2 people.  I had to adjust upward with each one so it would be at least a challenge.  

At the end of the game last night, Charley took the worm they saved in the water bottle to the biology professor at the college to look at.  I'm thinking it would be cool to have the professor be a member of the conspiracy group and become their contact, using the worm to initiate the whole thing.  I left that whole situation ambiguous just in case I decide to do that.  That way he can give them info about the assistant on the first adventure that got away from them, and that can be the start of the next adventure.  

anyway, it's a thought...

melodie

[Zak Arntson]

Ron,
What a wonderful statement about the game. I think what you're getting at is that the game condenses moment-to-moment events into a simple outcome open to group interpretation. There's one-roll, count successes (measured as 4 or above), with outcomes doing both quantity (damage to Safety or Sanity) and quality (Yes, and; No, and; Yes, but). Combine that with a set of skills that clearly promote an action-oriented play style.

In Chthonian, however, there is less investigation, and what there is of it is more ...proactive? maybe is the word...  not sure here, but it plays more like a video game.

Awesome. The proactive and video game qualities were very much a conscious design decision. Glad it works in play!

Also, the descriptions of the monsters are very clear and ugly, which isn't the case as often in COC.   They just don't have sick puppies like Zak working for them (hee!).  That really adds to the game as far as I'm concerned.  You have something very icky in your face and you know it.

What I've noticed in CoC is that monsters are either in-your-face and not really scary to a modern audience. Lovecraft's ghouls, dog-like and hooved may have been scary, but the illustrations in the CoC books make them look more like a D&D monster. To gross people out now, you've got to combine emotion with sympathy with splattergore. Hence you have things like pitiable possessed Teacher's Assistants and ex-dogs (which all started life as puppies).

My group didn't really get the whole idea of having 3 combat stats.  They felt they were too ambiguous, and only ended up using one of their fight stats during the game.  They also mentioned the lack of a defense stat.  

I did have 2 combat stats (Shoot and Brawl), but my Players complained about an unused Shoot stat (only one Character had a gun). I created a customizable Fight stat to help this. Here's my answer to your players:

- Brawl is used as both an offensive and defensive melee skill. If you want a Character that focuses on defense, give her a defensive Descriptor.

- While Brawl and Shoot are clear in their purpose, Fight is left up to you, as Player. Remember that you can burn a Descriptor once during a scene. So if you want a gun-meister, write a gun into her Fight Descriptor. This way you can burn two Descriptors in a single scene.

If that's still unclear, let me know. It looks like I'll have to write the Chthonian rules more clearly.

Failed rolls:  there were a couple of times when there was a failed roll but it really wasn't appropriate to assign damage.  Like when Charley threw a rock at the worm guy and failed the roll.

It's important to notice the name of the "damage" stat: Safety. By throwing a rock at the worm guy, he's not necessarily getting hurt. He's becoming more unsafe.

sanity checks:  Making the sanity check after the first combat rolls kinda interrupts the flow of combat.

This was a concern of mine. My answer would be the change you suggest: moving the Sanity roll to the end of the combat. It would not keep from jarring the participants, but also better reflect the machismo of the source material (Source material here as video games and b-movies, also the reason to change the term Disorder to Attitude).

Also in the realm of sanity:  rolling to gain sanity back is a good thing, but being able to get rid of an attitude they just got kinda confused them.  
-SNIP-

Thank you for the observation, and a good suggestion. I will mull this one over.

The use of magic:  you know this one would come up again, mainly because of the cultist chanting and summoning up a monster from another dimension.  If it's good for the cultist, it should be good for them, too.  They want some kind of...maybe..lore skill or something..to be able to use.

Magic would simply be a difficult test with both Safety and Sanity damage (and even 2+ successes would incur damage). Something like, Casting the spell is Difficulty 6, Damage (Safety AND Sanity: 1P/1P/1T), and x1.5 successes to cast. Use Investigate in the place of a Lore skill. As an advanced rule, I would allow arbitrary skill scores set through group discussion. Chthonian is intended to provide short stories that share more a mythos than a set of characters. Since your Players sound attached to their characters, I would suggest that they are allowed to modify their Skills at the end of the scenario to better reflect their Characters' experiences.

During the game, the Characters' investigation and mythos lore should further the plot rather than increase Character effectiveness.

They really loved it, and were on the edge of their seats the whole time, but at the end just came out with all this stuff I wasn't expecting.  The only concern I have is that the formula for deciding how many successes it takes to defeat a monster doesn't really work with 2 people.

I read the critique as enthusiasm towards improving the game, so yay! I wonder how the formula scales. Something to work out, through playtesting and possibly more rigorous (i.e., write a program or something) means.

At the end of the game last night ...
-SNIP-
... and that can be the start of the next adventure.

If your group is comfortable, why not run an adventure in the same mythos, but with entirely different Characters? Perhaps the biology professor contacts another group of folks, who become the Characters for the new scenario? You could tie in prior events (worm-possession, green possessing goo, evil dogs) but with a different perspective.

I'm even toying with the tie between a Player's different Characters would be sharing the Characters' Attitudes. Would be a neat form of synchronicity.

So, in closing, wow! Great Actual Play post, Melodie. Thank you so very much, and I'm looking forward to hearing more!

[rabidchyld]

Thanks Zak!  

As usual you've made everything completely clear, I appreciate it.  I will discuss all of the things with my group and let them know, and that will ease their minds.  

I would suggest, though, with the fight descriptors that you maybe write a note in the rules somewhere that you can put a defensive descriptor in there if you want.  That would clarify things for everyone involved with little work from you.  

Everything else is gravy, baby, and I think next time we play I might try to throw in some magic with your suggestions.  

My players are the type that like and want huge campaign games that get more involved as they go along with a mythos and history all their own.  Not that it necessarily has to be complicated, just that they really like to give their characters life and their favorite way to do that is to give them a nice history.  I don't think it's necessary to increase their stats after every game, but I will talk with them about increasing their characters' effectiveness before the next game and see what they can come up with.  During the game, though, their investigation and lore does further the plot, not their effectiveness.  They can use things they learned from previous games....and try to piece together what's currently happening.  

My players are really enjoying the game, and are very happy creating their own world.  I'm thinking about the next game already.  I want to bring back the assistant, and maybe some magic.  

melodie