Few questions...

[Shawn Conard]

I have only recently downloaded and printed myself a copy of Donjon, but I hope to be running the game in the not-so-distant future.  Anyway, in the process of trying to explain the game to my (I hope) players, I've come across a few stumbling blocks.  I was hoping someone here could help me out with them.

1)  Do saves count as abilities, in that you can use either an ability or a save on a single roll, but not both?  In other words, does having a Royal Food Taster ability help shrug of injested toxins, or is it better to just boost your Save vs. Poison, etc.  Ok, yeah, maybe this is a bad example, but you get the idea.

2)  Is there a good way to represent someone fighting with a weapon in each hand, or do I just have them create a single weapon called "paired daggers" or something?

3)  Do people get much use out of Hospitality?  The other town stats involve things that the players will always want to buy, but the importance of Hospitality seems to be entirely roleplayed.  In some games that wouldn't be an issue, but in Donjon it seems like the Donjon Master is encouraged to kick the PCs out of the town as soon as possible in order to get on with the adventure.  Ok, ok.  This one isn't really a rules question.  I'm really just asking for advice from people who have actually run the game.  How much time do the PCs spend in towns?  Does anything especially important happen there?

4)  Do players have to use at least one die on a spending test?  It makes sense in a lot of ways, except that a rich noble who buys a friend a single drink will spend a significant amount of wealth (considering how difficult it is to boost a high wealth score) to purchase that one drink.  I guess this ties in with the Hospitality question, simply because most non-Hospitality examples should require spending at least one die.

Any input would be appreciated.  Thanks.

~Shawn Conard

[Wulf]

1)  Do saves count as abilities, in that you can use either an ability or a save on a single roll, but not both?

As far as I can see, you can add an Attribute plus a saving throw PLUS an Ability. That's what I was doing. A Royal Food Taster would probably just keel over dead, mind you, he was just the courtly equal of a miner's canary...

2)  Is there a good way to represent someone fighting with a weapon in each hand, or do I just have them create a single weapon called "paired daggers" or something?

Hmm... you could use the Ability and add in two lots of weapon dice... Make sure you use SHARP daggers though, or they only get 0 dice!

3)  Do people get much use out of Hospitality?  

I was wondering that too. Useful, I suppose, in a well-organised campaign, but otherwise not much use.

4)  Do players have to use at least one die on a spending test?

I'd say no. That would represent some item so cheap it didn't affect your Wealth. Just like not all looting for Wealth raises it.

Mind you, I've only played one game...

Wulf

[RamblingMan]

2) Is there a good way to represent someone fighting with a weapon in each hand, or do I just have them create a single weapon called "paired daggers" or something?

If I were doing it, I'd have something like a secondary ability that added to Initiative Tests (extra attacks) if wielding two weapons, or something like that.

[Mike Holmes]

2)  Is there a good way to represent someone fighting with a weapon in each hand, or do I just have them create a single weapon called "paired daggers" or something?

RM's got it. If it means that the PC gets more attacks, it's an initiative adder.

Do people get much use out of Hospitality?  The other town stats involve things that the players will always want to buy, but the importance of Hospitality seems to be entirely roleplayed.  In some games that wouldn't be an issue, but in Donjon it seems like the Donjon Master is encouraged to kick the PCs out of the town as soon as possible in order to get on with the adventure.  Ok, ok.  This one isn't really a rules question.  I'm really just asking for advice from people who have actually run the game.  How much time do the PCs spend in towns?  Does anything especially important happen there?

My impression is that sometimes the PCs never leave. One sorta interesting thing about Donjon is that, if the players want, and if the GM doesn't mind, the "adventure" can be made up on the fly by using abilities. Town abilities are no exception.

Think of all abilities as equal. It's only lack of player ingenuity that makes one ability less valuable than another. Think of it this way: theoretically, you can do anything with any ability. You just have to figure out a fun and creative way to describe it. It's the best part of the game.

4)  Do players have to use at least one die on a spending test?  

Just reinforcing the negative response, here. You can't think of a level of wealth as a coherent chunk. It's a rating of wealth in abstrat terms. Narrate the effect however you like. Perhaps getting something with zero wealth is just too small an expenditure to count, if that makes realtive sense. On a lucky roll, narrate finding the money to buy it on the way into the shop (in this case Wealth is something akin to leprechaun luck; you could say that all of a certain character's wealth is "found" money.) If the character is a thief, perhaps he stole what he needed on the way to the shop. In this case, the character's Wealth is partly represented by the idea that he's constantly taking things that aren't his. The excellent result of the roll indicates these circumstances.

This is a fun way to make your character seem cool in these cases.

Mike

[Shawn Conard]

Great advice.  Thanks for the help, everyone.

~Shawn Conard

[Wulf]

2)  Is there a good way to represent someone fighting with a weapon in each hand, or do I just have them create a single weapon called "paired daggers" or something?

RM's got it. If it means that the PC gets more attacks, it's an initiative adder.

I'd be wary of that. If the intent is to represent extra attacks, then extra Initiative allows extra actions, whether they are attacks or not. To represent specific two-weapon attack combos, I prefer my idea. Not that I'm against high Initiatives... one of my own has Initiative 7 as her basic Initiative!

Wulf

[RamblingMan]

Mmm, you have a point, although I suppose you could roll the extra added init. as "attack-only" actions.  But to be honest, I don't really understand your suggestion.  Could you rephrase it?

[Wulf]

Mmm, you have a point, although I suppose you could roll the extra added init. as "attack-only" actions.  But to be honest, I don't really understand your suggestion.  Could you rephrase it?

Very simple, take an Ability of 'Attack With Two daggers'. When you use it, roll Adroitness plus the ability. If you hit, damage dice are successes, plus Virility, plus two lots of dagger dice (probably one each). Unless you allowed 'Pair of matched Daggers' as one item, you'd have to use up two weapon slots though...

Wulf

[Shawn Conard]

I can't see any reason not to allow a "pair of matched daggers" as a single weapon.  I mean, if "fire-breath" or "huge rocky fists" or "lots of sharp spines" are all counted as individual weapons, than so is a set of daggers.  On the other hand, I'd be fine with people using two weapons at once, as long as (ignoring the effects of abilities) each attack was with one weapon or the other.  Handy when using multiple magical weapons, each with different abilities.

Wait a second...  A tiny dragon with Virility 3 might still have some really hot fire-breath that does 3 damage.  That fire-breath is two handed, right?  Hrm...  Maybe I'll just have the player make something up and agree with them as long as it isn't too abusive.  I'll certainly point them in the direction of appropriate abilities, just in case they are interested.

~Shawn Conard