A Question about damage

[Mordacc]

Ok, i have some questions on damage.  First, in the appendix it will say for some weapons that it has a damage of, say, ST + 2c.  Now i take that to mean +2 cutting, but what difference does it make if the damage is cutting, piercing or mass?  Is ST +2c and different from ST + 2p or ST + 2b?  Second, why is it that in the first section of weapons it only has entries for damage like ST +2 and later on it says ST +2c?  Wouldnt a greatsword do extra cutting damage?
My last question is about high strength and damage.  I will soon be running a campaign based on dragon hunting and because of dragons high strength, it seems virtually impossible to have only cuts and scratchs.  For example, Bob, the powerhouse take all the hits and keep going guy of the group has a toughness of 7 and full plate.  the dragon swipes at the poor bastard and lets say its strength is 20 and to give bob the advantage we'll say the dragon tied for its margin of success and we'll say it hit because its...well, a dragon.  THat would still be a level 7 wound to bob.  how might i make it possible for there to be "just fleshwounds".
Sorry if this isnt written as clearly and fluidly as it could be but im tired and i will rewrite the questions if its too incomprehensible.

TRoS fan/freak/obsessee/playing day and night/worshiper #1,
Mordacc

[Brian Leybourne]

Yes, the c, p or b after the damage rating for a weapon means Cutting, Piercing or Bashing.

The first section doesn't use them because the damage is listed in a column called "Cutting" or "Thrusting", so you're supposed to be able to work out what kind of damage it's referring to :-) Later on, there's only the one column and so it uses that notation so you know.

High Strength and Damage? I don't have an answer for you - that's one of the pitfalls of this kind of system. Generally, it wont come up much in play, and frankly, if a character takes a swipe from a dragon, they should be dead :-)

Brian.

[Jake Norwood]

Generally, it wont come up much in play, and frankly, if a character takes a swipe from a dragon, they should be dead :-)

I agree with Brian on this account, however it may not be what you're looking for in Play (sounds like it's not). I would possible add a more randomizing element or make sure that the players have lots of Luck Dice on hand to burn, so that they don't get hit at all (that's how they do it in the movies).

Jake

[Valamir]

My rule of thumb would be 1 margin of success from a damageing enough nasty should be just flat out death.  But because the brush with death flesh wounds are fun ("I got this scar from a big drake down Langerton way") I'd say that a 0 margin of success attack (i.e. a defense that just barely equaled the attack) would result in a level 1 or 2 type wound.

[Brian Leybourne]

I agree with Brian on this account, however it may not be what you're looking for in Play (sounds like it's not). I would possible add a more randomizing element or make sure that the players have lots of Luck Dice on hand to burn, so that they don't get hit at all (that's how they do it in the movies).

Also, (depending on Seneschal fiat) the dragon (or whatever) may decide to have some fun with the opponent, either a) not attacking at full strength (effectively lower ST, this is Seneschal whim to look at a level 5 result and decide it was a level 3 and the player never knows different), or b) the dragon goes for limbs where level 5 wounds suck but don't instantly kill. Why? Maybe it's cat-like and wants to play with it's food.

Brian.

[Callan S.]

I'd almost wonder if its this is the right system to do this in. One test might be to take a character and jump him off a cliff...if he lives, its probably the right system to do it in.

Or as said, the luck dodging.

Another might be to use some tactics...mebe lure the creature into a smaller cave, so it can't wind up for the full punch (uses a lower strength)

[Brian Leybourne]

Another might be to use some tactics...mebe lure the creature into a smaller cave, so it can't wind up for the full punch (uses a lower strength)

Wow, only your 4th post and you've already worked it out. :-)

TROS combat isn't about who is the strongest or toughest (or who isn't). It's about who is the smartest.

Brian.

[Mordacc]

i like the idea of having it so if the margin of success is tied (which by the way seems to happen quite frequently in our games for a reason unknown to me, but it just does), then the wound is lower.  Also, yes, there will not be too many duels between a fighter and a dragon.  thats pretty dumb on the players part.  Most of the killing will be from archers or tactics such as using an avalanche to bury a dragon or possibly use ballistas against it.  although the duel will come up occasionally becuase if the player survives it will be very cool to boast around your dragonhide armor :-)

[Callan S.]

Another might be to use some tactics...mebe lure the creature into a smaller cave, so it can't wind up for the full punch (uses a lower strength)

Wow, only your 4th post and you've already worked it out. :-)

TROS combat isn't about who is the strongest or toughest (or who isn't). It's about who is the smartest.

Brian.

The poster seemed to be more asking how to soften things from his side of the GM screen, so I didn't really go into player tactics for that reason. God, the players should be using all sorts of wicked tactics. The first I'd recommend is DON'T hunt dragons. If you do, use tons of fake archers...set up it up somehow so that lots of arrows are fired from dozens of possitions (it doesn't have to be well done), by mechanical or sorcerous means. Then you can have your sniper archers hidden amongst it, unlikely to die for a good 10 seconds or so. And this still sucks! Fall back to plan B: Don't hunt dragons!

[arxhon]

I think the dragons were put there for completion's sake, and to show off how tough creatures could be represented by the system. Besides, what is a fantasy game without dragons? Personally, I like dragons, and I'm happy to see that the dragons/wyrms are exceptionally brutally uber-tough! D&D dragons were pretty wimpy when you think about it, unless they were intelligently played by the GM and that's still more a factor of intelligence than outright toughness.

[Brian Leybourne]

If you think TROS dragons are nasty, you should see Trolls ;-)

Brian.

[Fallen_Icarus]

If you think TROS dragons are nasty, you should see Trolls ;-)

I cant wait for OBAM to come out.  Fortunatly, my players are intelligent enough to reallize the deadly nature of the combat system and not run head long into Dragon lair.  (they hardly want to get into normal combat)

I am interested to see the more untamed and viscious places of Weyrth fleshed out.  I know that the Hef can mate with humans and so I was wondering how many of the other races could be used as half-breeds.  For instance, could a Gol/Human combo come about?  More on the subject, could a person be born with Dragon blood?  If so, what kind of racial bonuses/penalties would you suggest?

Adding a rich story and history to the PCs and NPCs (even Dragons) combined with smart tactics, could make the differance in a lot of battles.  I.e.: The Wyrm hunters have a fellow in their ranks with distant Dragon blood giving him an advantage.  Or something along those lines.

I'm just rambling now so I'll shut up.

Eric[/quote]

[Brian Leybourne]

There's nothing in OBAM about Gol or Dragons cross-breeding with humans (although there is a greatly expanded section on what the Hef can/will breed with including some very very nasty examples).

I guess my gut/typical response is - it's your game. If you want to have humans breeding with Gol, then go for it, there is certainly a precident with the Hef, and with one other type of Trollspawn from the book (a new one). Stats and suchlike are easy enough to extrapolate from the stats for Gol and Dragons, if that's your bag. Maybe human sorcerers are cross-breeds with something, which is where the gifted blood comes from (slight D20 crossover there I guess, since the PHB hints that 3e's sorcerers may be the result of dragon/other race crossbreeds in their ancestory). You could also use some other entries from the book to help you along, such as what happen when a mortal gets introduced to Trolls blood.

Rich story, History and Tactics? Making a difference? Hell yeah, that's what TROS is all about.

Brian.

[Callan S.]

I'd guess that it'd have to be a human male mating with a female dragon (Because of birth probs, humans have enough probs birthing human babies)

So...you go out for a few quiet ones with the lads.

The next moring you wake up in an unfamiliar bed...actually its a pile of gold, next to a bloody huge reptile.

Your next thoughts are 'Perhaps we should get breakfast and see where this goes...'

Yeah, I'm trying to hint at how surreal this is.

Not to mention chromosomes not matching in the least. I don't even think 'its something to do with magic' jumps that hurdle.

Now, if it started with alchemical test subjects...a sorcerer with a supply of dragons blood, trying to fuse it to a mortal subject with magic. That is probably better.

[arxhon]

The whole hef-wife thing is pretty disturbing...i can't imagine those women being willing participants. Make for some great games in Savaxen >:-).

Dragon crossbreeds, eh? I like the idea of a sorceror with dragon's blood, though that's more of an enforced genetic manipulation than true crossbreeding, but hey...it sounds great.