spawn questions

[random]

I'm kind of confused about how Spawn is meant to work.  (Note that I'm only bringing it up here because I'd like to get some public clarification: for my own purposes, if I can manage to get my gaming group interested in playing Sorcerer, I'll probably simplify the power quite a bit if it ever comes up.)

OK, the rules say:

• Spawning demon takes Lethal damage with victories equal to the new Spawn's power. Lethal damage has lasting penalties equal to victories + demon's power.  What does "demon's power" mean in this context? Big demons are likely to kill themselves when spawning?
  
• Spawning demon goes into Need immediately. (what does this mean? don't demons always want to get a dose of their Need after using one of their powers?)
  
• Spawning demon may produce spawn with a total power equal to or less than its own.
  [/list:u]
  
  In a separate topic, Ron clarifies:
  

  
  The opposing dice for the Power roll of the demon is equal to the number of existing Spawn, including the one being produced. So it's easy: vs. 1 die for the first Spawn, vs. 2 dice for the next, etc.
  

  
  I don't see where there's a power roll for the spawning demon in the rules at all. Why bother with a roll? There's a hard limit on how many spawn can be produced (item three in the list), so if a demon wants to create a spawn, it seems to me that it should just take the lethal damage and get the spawn.
  
  Also, since there's a hard limit on the number of spawn that can be produced, I don't see any danger of "demon factories".  Am I missing something?  Did the description of this ability change completely between the PDF and hardcover rules?
  
  Cheers,
  
  rnd
  
  

[Ron Edwards]

Hey Random,

I wonder what I was talking about with that Power roll? I'm looking at my own book, mind you, and you're right, it's not there.

OK, let's use an example. A demon with Power 6 has just been fed to the gills with its Need, and is going to produce a couple of Spawn. That's Lethal Special Damage for the demon, with 2 victories, so that's 4 one-action penalties plus (2 + 6) for the long-term ones. No rolling is necessary.

Let's deal with that damage. First of all, the demon isn't killed. Figuring that its Stamina is 5, it has to take 11 lasting penalties before that happens, and it's taken 8. It's weak and sickly, but it's alive. (Note that having Vitality is a fine idea - for this purpose, the demon may effectively ignore 6 of the penalties. See? 6 were added, 6 were negated, leaving only the +2. If you want strong and reliable Spawning demons, give them Vitality too.)

OK, what next? The two Spawn may have 3 Power each, which means they have Will 3 and Stamina and Lore of 2 each. Each may have any two abilities of the parent demon.

That parent was just fed its Need, remember? Having Spawned, it's going to want more Right Now. Yes, any demon wouldn't MIND a taste following the use of its powers, but it's not going to resent not getting it, unless it's been a week or so since last time, or it's started down the road to rebellion, or the actions involved militate against its Desire.

Considering that I don't think especially clearly about Spawn (evidently), let me know what I'm leaving out this time.

Best,
Ron

[random]

On 2001-10-23 00:24, Ron Edwards wrote:

That parent was just fed its Need, remember? Having Spawned, it's going to want more Right Now. Yes, any demon wouldn't MIND a taste following the use of its powers, but it's not going to resent not getting it, unless it's been a week or so since last time, or it's started down the road to rebellion, or the actions involved militate against its Desire.

Considering that I don't think especially clearly about Spawn (evidently), let me know what I'm leaving out this time.

Ron,

Thanks for the clarification.  I get it now.  The confusion was largely brought about by that other thread, with its talk of power rolls and demon factories.  

Cheers,

rnd