never ending fight

[lokdu]

I have some problems with fight in TROS .
With equal skilled opponents and pretty good armor : some chain , leather and shield it's look like the fight is too long . Perhaps i'm a poor tactitian , or i missed something.

ie : Fight with
1 - norman warrior
    - weapon : bastard sword
    - armor : chain on chest and pot helm on head , leather on arms and legs, and a large shield .

2 - a viking warrior
    - weapon : 1 hand haxe
    - armor : chain on chest and pot helm on head , leather on arms and legs, and a small shield .

Fight with TROS similator
screen shot

There can be only one...

------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Geralt opts for a Defensive stance

Cut & Thrust Kid opts for an Aggressive stance

------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Cut & Thrust Kid rushes in to attack, while Geralt tries to hold him off...

------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

At the start of the round, we refresh both combat pools


------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

First engagement...

Cut & Thrust Kid gains +2CP for his aggressive stance
Cut & Thrust Kid must pay an additional 1 dice to attack because he's out of range.
Cut & Thrust Kid takes a swing at Geralt's body (downward diagonal) with 9 dice...

Geralt gains +2CP for his defensive stance
Geralt tries to block Cut & Thrust Kid's attack, using 6 dice...
(TN 7) 9, 2, 6, 5, 5, 3, 2, 6, 7  - Result: 2
(TN 5) 4, 1, 9, 6, 18, 4  - Result: 3

Cut & Thrust Kid rolls and gets 2 successes.
Geralt rolls and gets 3 successes.

So, Geralt successfully blocks the attack and steals initiative!
------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Second engagement...

Geralt thrusts at Cut & Thrust Kid's chest with 5 dice...
Cut & Thrust Kid tries to block Geralt's attack, using 4 dice...
(TN 7) 16, 9, 6, 1, 3  - Result: 2
(TN 5) 8, 7, 3, 8  - Result: 3

Geralt rolls and gets 2 successes.
Cut & Thrust Kid rolls and gets 3 successes.

So, Cut & Thrust Kid successfully blocks the attack and steals initiative!

------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

At the start of the round, we refresh both combat pools


------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

First engagement...

Cut & Thrust Kid must pay an additional 1 dice to attack because he's out of range.
Cut & Thrust Kid tries to bind Geralt's weapon with 5 dice, hoping to create an advantage for the next hit...
Geralt tries to block Cut & Thrust Kid's attack, using 5 dice...
(TN 5) 3, 14, 5, 2, 2  - Result: 2
(TN 5) 3, 5, 7, 8, 2  - Result: 3

Cut & Thrust Kid rolls and gets 2 successes.
Geralt rolls and gets 3 successes.

So, Geralt successfully blocks the attack and steals initiative!
------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Second engagement...

Geralt thrusts at Cut & Thrust Kid's pelvic region with 4 dice...
Cut & Thrust Kid tries to block Geralt's attack, using 6 dice...
(TN 7) 7, 3, 12, 5  - Result: 2
(TN 5) 8, 5, 1, 26, 4, 3  - Result: 3

Geralt rolls and gets 2 successes.
Cut & Thrust Kid rolls and gets 3 successes.

So, Cut & Thrust Kid successfully blocks the attack and steals initiative!

------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

At the start of the round, we refresh both combat pools


------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

First engagement...

Cut & Thrust Kid must pay an additional 1 dice to attack because he's out of range.
Cut & Thrust Kid tries to bind Geralt's weapon with 7 dice, hoping to create an advantage for the next hit...
Geralt tries to block Cut & Thrust Kid's attack, using 5 dice...
(TN 5) 6, 1, 3, 25, 2, 8, 7  - Result: 4
(TN 5) 8, 3, 2, 8, 5  - Result: 3

Cut & Thrust Kid rolls and gets 4 successes.
Geralt rolls and gets 3 successes.

Cut & Thrust Kid traps Geralt's weapon, so Geralt will lose 1 dice on the next exchange.
------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Second engagement...

Geralt loses 1 dice thanks to Cut & Thrust Kid's bind maneuver.

Cut & Thrust Kid must pay an additional 1 dice to attack because he's out of range.
Cut & Thrust Kid takes a swing at Geralt's midsection with 3 dice...
Geralt tries to block Cut & Thrust Kid's attack, using 3 dice...
(TN 7) 1, 3, 9  - Result: 1
(TN 5) 1, 4, 17  - Result: 1

Cut & Thrust Kid rolls and gets 1 successes.
Geralt rolls and gets 1 successes.

Geralt just barely avoids the attack from Cut & Thrust Kid, who keeps initiative.

------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

At the start of the round, we refresh both combat pools


------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

First engagement...

Cut & Thrust Kid must pay an additional 1 dice to attack because he's out of range.
Cut & Thrust Kid leaps forward and stops, trying to catch Geralt off guard...
(TN 5) 6, 3, 6, 8, 9  - Result: 4
(TN 14) 3, 5, 13, 4, 17  - Result: 1

Cut & Thrust Kid rolls and gets 4 successes.
Geralt rolls and gets 1 successes.

Cut & Thrust Kid leaps forward, startling Geralt who falls back, expecting an attack. Geralt loses 3 dice from his CP at the start of the next exchange.
------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Second engagement...

Geralt loses 3 dice from Cut & Thrust Kid's Stop Short move...

Cut & Thrust Kid must pay an additional 1 dice to attack because he's out of range.
Cut & Thrust Kid takes a swing at Geralt's lower legs with 4 dice...
Geralt tries to block Cut & Thrust Kid's attack, using 6 dice...
(TN 7) 5, 8, 9, 3  - Result: 2
(TN 5) 9, 8, 5, 6, 3, 8  - Result: 5

Cut & Thrust Kid rolls and gets 2 successes.
Geralt rolls and gets 5 successes.

So, Geralt successfully blocks the attack and steals initiative!

------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

At the start of the round, we refresh both combat pools


------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

First engagement...

Geralt takes a swing at Cut & Thrust Kid's groin (upwards) with 6 dice...
Cut & Thrust Kid tries to block Geralt's attack, using 5 dice...
(TN 7) 8, 7, 13, 3, 2, 16  - Result: 4
(TN 5) 5, 5, 8, 3, 2  - Result: 3

Geralt rolls and gets 4 successes.
Cut & Thrust Kid rolls and gets 3 successes.

---------------------------------------
Attack successes: 1
Strength: 5
Weapon Damage: 0
---------------------------------------
Toughness: 5
Armor: 4
---------------------------------------

Geralt hits Cut & Thrust Kid with a total damage rating of 0... (Merely a scratch...)

------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Second engagement...

Geralt tries to bind Cut & Thrust Kid's weapon with 3 dice, hoping to create an advantage for the next hit...
Cut & Thrust Kid tries to block Geralt's attack, using 7 dice...
(TN 5) 6, 9, 2  - Result: 2
(TN 5) 9, 7, 2, 5, 5, 8, 9  - Result: 6

Geralt rolls and gets 2 successes.
Cut & Thrust Kid rolls and gets 6 successes.

So, Cut & Thrust Kid successfully blocks the attack and steals initiative!

------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

At the start of the round, we refresh both combat pools


------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

First engagement...

Cut & Thrust Kid must pay an additional 1 dice to attack because he's out of range.
Cut & Thrust Kid tries to bind Geralt's weapon with 6 dice, hoping to create an advantage for the next hit...
Geralt tries to block Cut & Thrust Kid's attack, using 4 dice...
(TN 5) 9, 1, 6, 4, 4, 7  - Result: 3
(TN 5) 1, 15, 6, 5  - Result: 3

Cut & Thrust Kid rolls and gets 3 successes.
Geralt rolls and gets 3 successes.

Geralt just barely avoids the attack from Cut & Thrust Kid, who keeps initiative.
------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Second engagement...

Cut & Thrust Kid must pay an additional 1 dice to attack because he's out of range.
Cut & Thrust Kid takes a swing at Geralt's arms/hands with 5 dice...
Geralt tries to block Cut & Thrust Kid's attack, using 5 dice...
(TN 7) 2, 5, 7, 2, 9  - Result: 2
(TN 5) 6, 6, 3, 2, 6  - Result: 3

Cut & Thrust Kid rolls and gets 2 successes.
Geralt rolls and gets 3 successes.

So, Geralt successfully blocks the attack and steals initiative!

------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

At the start of the round, we refresh both combat pools


------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

First engagement...

Geralt chooses not to make an attack, and passes initiative to Cut & Thrust Kid

Cut & Thrust Kid must pay an additional 1 dice to attack because he's out of range.
Cut & Thrust Kid takes a swing at Geralt's body (downward diagonal) with 8 dice...
Geralt attempts to counter Cut & Thrust Kid's attack with 3 dice...
(TN 7) 4, 9, 1, 18, 1, 2, 4, 7  - Result: 3
(TN 7) 3, 5, 1  - Result: 0

Cut & Thrust Kid rolls and gets 3 successes.
Geralt rolls and gets 0 successes.

---------------------------------------
Attack successes: 3
Strength: 5
Weapon Damage: 1
Bonus vs hard armor: 1
---------------------------------------
Toughness: 5
Armor: 12
---------------------------------------

Cut & Thrust Kid hits Geralt with a total damage rating of 0... (Merely a scratch...)

(Hand Axe adds extra shock...)

Because of Cut & Thrust Kid's successful attack, he moves into his optimal range.
------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Second engagement...

Cut & Thrust Kid takes a swing at Geralt's arms/hands with 4 dice...
Geralt tries to block Cut & Thrust Kid's attack, using 3 dice...
(TN 7) 4, 2, 2, 9  - Result: 1
(TN 5) 7, 8, 7  - Result: 3

Cut & Thrust Kid rolls and gets 1 successes.
Geralt rolls and gets 3 successes.

So, Geralt successfully blocks the attack and steals initiative!

------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

At the start of the round, we refresh both combat pools


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First engagement...

Geralt must pay an additional 1 dice to attack because he's out of range.
Please select Geralt's attack...

etc....
Any suggestion ?

[lokdu]

I just think long sword would be more historical for norman warrior .
But i'm allways stuck with the same very long fight problem.

[Muggins]

Depends what you mean by longsword. In real world terms, unaffected by D&D, the longsword refers to a blade used in the 13th to 15th centuries, with a handle long enough to be swung two handed, but which can be wielded onehanded from horseback. Thus, a longsword is completely anachronistic for a Norman warrior.

On the long fight bit, hmm....

Part of the problem is that neither combatant is trying to win the combat. Since the armour has cut down the dice pools, a lot of manouevers are just impossible. However, on the other hand, a strong blow is needed.

Try some of the more difficult moves- dodge and evade, dodge and weave, looking for the moment. Since both fighters could take a weak blow (1 or 2 successes), take the risk!

James

[Overdrive]

Hello lokdu, and welcome to the forum. (Had to say that at least once! Hope I'm still the first :-)

I didn't read the whole sequence thoroughly, but there sure are a lot of ways to deal with these kind of situations. First I'll note that you did generate some successful hits, but failed to do any damage due to the armor (especially the shields, since they add to armor value in relevant locations!). Had they been mostly unarmored, the fight would have been over very soon.

I'd also like to point out that you didn't much use the maneuvers, or at least gained little by using them. When two equally-skilled warriors in decent armor go against each other, you really need to exploit the weaknesses of your opponent. I'll list some of my favourite tactics:

1) Use simultaneous block/strike when using shield. The enemy strikes with about half of his dice; block with the superior shield DTN, attack an unprotected area (neck, feet, hands) with enough dice to cripple him. The enemy can only feint and hope to pass your defences.

2) Steal initiative! When attacked all-out (almost all or all dice), ditch defence and attack instead at an unarmored part. Steal initiative with enough dice and allocate the rest for the attack. Risky but effective, and may not work against heavier armors.

3) Against weak attacks or those aimed at heavily armored parts, no defence but attack; the enemy doesn't get to defend. So he does this to you, you feint, go for less armored areas, and kill the poor guy.

Then you can use half-swording, beat, counters (these work great!), anything. In the real game, I'd be really tempted to use grapple defences, pommel strikes and wrestling in some cases. Sadly, the combat sim lacks some very neat features.

Edit: got a phone call and missed by minutes.. :)

[lokdu]

Just finish a complete fight . Allways long fight , i'm not sure i can master this kind of fight with 3 players against 2 or 3 npc opponents .

You seem a brave fellow, I hate to kill you.
You seem a brave fellow, I hate to die.
Begin...

------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Geralt opts for a Neutral stance

Cut & Thrust Kid opts for an Aggressive stance

------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Cut & Thrust Kid rushes in to attack, while Geralt tries to hold him off...

------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

At the start of the round, we refresh both combat pools


------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

First engagement...

Cut & Thrust Kid gains +2CP for his aggressive stance
Cut & Thrust Kid must pay an additional 1 dice to attack because he's out of range.
Cut & Thrust Kid tries to bind Geralt's weapon with 9 dice, hoping to create an advantage for the next hit...
Geralt tries to do a partial evasion with 6 dice...
(TN 5) 5, 8, 7, 1, 1, 4, 8, 4, 2  - Result: 4
(TN 7) 9, 1, 4, 8, 2, 9  - Result: 3

Cut & Thrust Kid rolls and gets 4 successes.
Geralt rolls and gets 3 successes.

Cut & Thrust Kid traps Geralt's weapon, so Geralt will lose 1 dice on the next exchange.
------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Second engagement...

Geralt loses 1 dice thanks to Cut & Thrust Kid's bind maneuver.

Cut & Thrust Kid must pay an additional 1 dice to attack because he's out of range.
Cut & Thrust Kid tries to bind Geralt's weapon with 3 dice, hoping to create an advantage for the next hit...
Geralt tries to block Cut & Thrust Kid's attack, using 3 dice...
(TN 5) 1, 9, 4  - Result: 1
(TN 5) 7, 1, 9  - Result: 2

Cut & Thrust Kid rolls and gets 1 successes.
Geralt rolls and gets 2 successes.

So, Geralt successfully blocks the attack and steals initiative!

------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

At the start of the round, we refresh both combat pools


------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

First engagement...

Geralt tries to bind Cut & Thrust Kid's weapon with 6 dice, hoping to create an advantage for the next hit...
Cut & Thrust Kid tries to block Geralt's attack, using 6 dice...
(TN 5) 6, 2, 4, 2, 14, 1  - Result: 2
(TN 5) 1, 9, 13, 6, 2, 1  - Result: 3

Geralt rolls and gets 2 successes.
Cut & Thrust Kid rolls and gets 3 successes.

So, Cut & Thrust Kid successfully blocks the attack and steals initiative!
------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Second engagement...

Cut & Thrust Kid must pay an additional 1 dice to attack because he's out of range.
Cut & Thrust Kid tries to bind Geralt's weapon with 5 dice, hoping to create an advantage for the next hit...
Geralt tries to block Cut & Thrust Kid's attack, using 4 dice...
(TN 5) 17, 4, 6, 8, 3  - Result: 3
(TN 5) 2, 9, 7, 6  - Result: 3

Cut & Thrust Kid rolls and gets 3 successes.
Geralt rolls and gets 3 successes.

Geralt just barely avoids the attack from Cut & Thrust Kid, who keeps initiative.

------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

At the start of the round, we refresh both combat pools


------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

First engagement...

Cut & Thrust Kid must pay an additional 1 dice to attack because he's out of range.
Cut & Thrust Kid tries to bind Geralt's weapon with 5 dice, hoping to create an advantage for the next hit...
Geralt tries to block Cut & Thrust Kid's attack, using 5 dice...
(TN 5) 7, 4, 2, 4, 7  - Result: 2
(TN 5) 9, 12, 1, 2, 1  - Result: 2

Cut & Thrust Kid rolls and gets 2 successes.
Geralt rolls and gets 2 successes.

Geralt just barely avoids the attack from Cut & Thrust Kid, who keeps initiative.
------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Second engagement...

Cut & Thrust Kid must pay an additional 1 dice to attack because he's out of range.
Cut & Thrust Kid tries to bind Geralt's weapon with 5 dice, hoping to create an advantage for the next hit...
Geralt tries to block Cut & Thrust Kid's attack, using 5 dice...
(TN 5) 9, 5, 3, 8, 1  - Result: 3
(TN 5) 28, 5, 3, 1, 6  - Result: 3

Cut & Thrust Kid rolls and gets 3 successes.
Geralt rolls and gets 3 successes.

Geralt just barely avoids the attack from Cut & Thrust Kid, who keeps initiative.

------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

At the start of the round, we refresh both combat pools


------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

First engagement...

Cut & Thrust Kid must pay an additional 1 dice to attack because he's out of range.
Cut & Thrust Kid leaps forward and stops, trying to catch Geralt off guard...
(TN 5) 9, 2, 1, 7, 1  - Result: 2
(TN 11) 7, 1, 7, 2, 14  - Result: 1

Cut & Thrust Kid rolls and gets 2 successes.
Geralt rolls and gets 1 successes.

Cut & Thrust Kid leaps forward, startling Geralt who falls back, expecting an attack. Geralt loses 1 dice from his CP at the start of the next exchange.
------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Second engagement...

Geralt loses 1 dice from Cut & Thrust Kid's Stop Short move...

Cut & Thrust Kid must pay an additional 1 dice to attack because he's out of range.
Cut & Thrust Kid tries to bind Geralt's weapon with 6 dice, hoping to create an advantage for the next hit...
Geralt tries to block Cut & Thrust Kid's attack, using 3 dice...
(TN 5) 1, 5, 1, 6, 2, 6  - Result: 3
(TN 5) 9, 8, 4  - Result: 2

Cut & Thrust Kid rolls and gets 3 successes.
Geralt rolls and gets 2 successes.

Cut & Thrust Kid traps Geralt's weapon, so Geralt will lose 1 dice on the next exchange.

------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

At the start of the round, we refresh both combat pools


------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

First engagement...

Geralt loses 1 dice thanks to Cut & Thrust Kid's bind maneuver.

Cut & Thrust Kid must pay an additional 1 dice to attack because he's out of range.
Cut & Thrust Kid tries to bind Geralt's weapon with 8 dice, hoping to create an advantage for the next hit...
Geralt tries to block Cut & Thrust Kid's attack, using 5 dice...
(TN 5) 4, 7, 5, 1, 9, 18, 7, 12  - Result: 6
(TN 5) 5, 4, 6, 17, 6  - Result: 4

Cut & Thrust Kid rolls and gets 6 successes.
Geralt rolls and gets 4 successes.

Cut & Thrust Kid traps Geralt's weapon, so Geralt will lose 2 dice on the next exchange.
------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Second engagement...

Geralt loses 2 dice thanks to Cut & Thrust Kid's bind maneuver.

Cut & Thrust Kid must pay an additional 1 dice to attack because he's out of range.
Cut & Thrust Kid takes a swing at Geralt's lower legs with 3 dice...
Geralt tries to block Cut & Thrust Kid's attack, using 2 dice...
(TN 7) 8, 3, 8  - Result: 2
(TN 5) 5, 5  - Result: 2

Cut & Thrust Kid rolls and gets 2 successes.
Geralt rolls and gets 2 successes.

Geralt just barely avoids the attack from Cut & Thrust Kid, who keeps initiative.

------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

At the start of the round, we refresh both combat pools


------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

First engagement...

Cut & Thrust Kid must pay an additional 1 dice to attack because he's out of range.
Cut & Thrust Kid tries to bind Geralt's weapon with 8 dice, hoping to create an advantage for the next hit...
Geralt tries to bash aside Cut & Thrust Kid's weapon with 5 dice, leaving it open for a counter attack...
(TN 5) 8, 2, 1, 24, 1, 13, 8, 5  - Result: 5
(TN 5) 9, 8, 6, 8, 7  - Result: 5

Cut & Thrust Kid rolls and gets 5 successes.
Geralt rolls and gets 5 successes.

Geralt just barely avoids the attack from Cut & Thrust Kid, who keeps initiative.
------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Second engagement...

Cut & Thrust Kid must pay an additional 1 dice to attack because he's out of range.
Cut & Thrust Kid takes a swing at Geralt's lower legs with 3 dice...
Geralt tries to bash aside Cut & Thrust Kid's weapon with 1 dice, leaving it open for a counter attack...
(TN 7) 1, 6, 8  - Result: 1
(TN 5) 4  - Result: 0

Cut & Thrust Kid rolls and gets 1 successes.
Geralt rolls and gets 0 successes.

---------------------------------------
Attack successes: 1
Strength: 5
Weapon Damage: 1
---------------------------------------
Toughness: 5
Armor: 2
---------------------------------------

Cut & Thrust Kid hits Geralt with a total damage rating of 0... (Merely a scratch...)

(Hand Axe adds extra shock...)

Because of Cut & Thrust Kid's successful attack, he moves into his optimal range.

------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

At the start of the round, we refresh both combat pools


------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

First engagement...

Cut & Thrust Kid tries to bind Geralt's weapon with 4 dice, hoping to create an advantage for the next hit...
Geralt tries to block Cut & Thrust Kid's attack, using 4 dice...
(TN 5) 5, 7, 14, 4  - Result: 3
(TN 5) 17, 15, 7, 6  - Result: 4

Cut & Thrust Kid rolls and gets 3 successes.
Geralt rolls and gets 4 successes.

So, Geralt successfully blocks the attack and steals initiative!
------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Second engagement...

Geralt must pay an additional 1 dice to attack because he's out of range.
Geralt chooses not to make an attack, and passes initiative to Cut & Thrust Kid

Cut & Thrust Kid tries to bind Geralt's weapon with 8 dice, hoping to create an advantage for the next hit...
Geralt tries to bash aside Cut & Thrust Kid's weapon with 4 dice, leaving it open for a counter attack...
(TN 5) 12, 2, 18, 6, 6, 3, 14, 1  - Result: 5
(TN 5) 2, 5, 3, 6  - Result: 2

Cut & Thrust Kid rolls and gets 5 successes.
Geralt rolls and gets 2 successes.

Cut & Thrust Kid traps Geralt's weapon, so Geralt will lose 3 dice on the next exchange.

------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

At the start of the round, we refresh both combat pools


------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

First engagement...

Geralt loses 3 dice thanks to Cut & Thrust Kid's bind maneuver.

Cut & Thrust Kid tries to bind Geralt's weapon with 7 dice, hoping to create an advantage for the next hit...
Geralt tries to block Cut & Thrust Kid's attack, using 4 dice...
(TN 5) 5, 1, 8, 9, 1, 7, 3  - Result: 4
(TN 5) 11, 2, 2, 2  - Result: 1

Cut & Thrust Kid rolls and gets 4 successes.
Geralt rolls and gets 1 successes.

Cut & Thrust Kid traps Geralt's weapon, so Geralt will lose 3 dice on the next exchange.
------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Second engagement...

Geralt loses 3 dice thanks to Cut & Thrust Kid's bind maneuver.

Cut & Thrust Kid takes a swing at Geralt's lower legs with 6 dice...
Geralt doesn't have enough dice left to defend with...
(TN 7) 1, 7, 7, 8, 6, 2  - Result: 3
(TN 5)  - Result: 0

Cut & Thrust Kid rolls and gets 3 successes.
Geralt rolls and gets 0 successes.

---------------------------------------
Attack successes: 3
Strength: 5
Weapon Damage: 1
---------------------------------------
Toughness: 5
Armor: 2
---------------------------------------

Cut & Thrust Kid hits Geralt with a total damage rating of 2... (Solid blow to knee, funny bone effect)

(Hand Axe adds extra shock...)
Geralt loses the rest of his combat pool due to shock!

------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

At the start of the round, we refresh both combat pools

Geralt loses 7 dice from leftover shock.
(TN 2) 7, 3, 3, 4, 7  - Result: 5
Geralt is bleeding, but does not lose Health this round.

------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

First engagement...

Cut & Thrust Kid takes a swing at Geralt's body (downward vertical) with 12 dice...
Geralt tries to block Cut & Thrust Kid's attack, using 3 dice...
(TN 7) 1, 17, 3, 3, 4, 7, 5, 1, 17, 7, 7, 7  - Result: 6
(TN 5) 7, 11, 1  - Result: 2

Cut & Thrust Kid rolls and gets 6 successes.
Geralt rolls and gets 2 successes.

---------------------------------------
Attack successes: 4
Strength: 5
Weapon Damage: 1
---------------------------------------
Toughness: 5
Armor: 4
---------------------------------------

Cut & Thrust Kid hits Geralt with a total damage rating of 1... (Scalp cut)

(Hand Axe adds extra shock...)
Geralt loses the rest of his combat pool due to shock!
------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Second engagement...

Both pools are at zero, so we'll end the round early.

------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

At the start of the round, we refresh both combat pools

Geralt is getting fatigued and loses 1CP

Cut & Thrust Kid is getting fatigued and loses 1CP

Geralt loses 4 dice from leftover shock.
(TN 5) 6, 18, 5, 8, 2  - Result: 4
Geralt is bleeding, but does not lose Health this round.

------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

First engagement...

Cut & Thrust Kid tries to bind Geralt's weapon with 4 dice, hoping to create an advantage for the next hit...
Geralt tries to block Cut & Thrust Kid's attack, using 2 dice...
(TN 5) 6, 1, 11, 2  - Result: 2
(TN 5) 9, 3  - Result: 1

Cut & Thrust Kid rolls and gets 2 successes.
Geralt rolls and gets 1 successes.

Cut & Thrust Kid traps Geralt's weapon, so Geralt will lose 1 dice on the next exchange.
------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Second engagement...

Geralt loses 1 dice thanks to Cut & Thrust Kid's bind maneuver.

Cut & Thrust Kid takes a swing at Geralt's body (downward vertical) with 7 dice...
Geralt tries to block Cut & Thrust Kid's attack, using 2 dice...
(TN 7) 6, 2, 18, 2, 5, 5, 1  - Result: 1
(TN 5) 7, 9  - Result: 2

Cut & Thrust Kid rolls and gets 1 successes.
Geralt rolls and gets 2 successes.

So, Geralt successfully blocks the attack and steals initiative!

------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

At the start of the round, we refresh both combat pools

(TN 5) 3, 5, 5, 5, 2  - Result: 3
Geralt is bleeding, but does not lose Health this round.

------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

First engagement...

Geralt must pay an additional 1 dice to attack because he's out of range.
Geralt tries to bind Cut & Thrust Kid's weapon with 4 dice, hoping to create an advantage for the next hit...
Please select Cut & Thrust Kid's defense...

Cut & Thrust Kid takes a swing at Geralt's lower legs with 12 dice...

Determining who gets to swing first...

Initiative goes to original attacker...
Geralt attacks first...

Cut & Thrust Kid can attempt to steal initiative if he wishes...
(TN 5) 1, 11, 7, 3  - Result: 2

Geralt rolls and gets 2 successes.
Geralt traps Cut & Thrust Kid's weapon, so Cut & Thrust Kid will lose 2 dice on the next exchange.
(TN 7) 8, 4, 4, 2, 4, 25, 17, 5, 5, 7, 3, 2  - Result: 4

Cut & Thrust Kid rolls and gets 4 successes.
---------------------------------------
Attack successes: 4
Strength: 5
Weapon Damage: 1
---------------------------------------
Toughness: 5
Armor: 2
---------------------------------------

Cut & Thrust Kid hits Geralt with a total damage rating of 3... (Shin bone chipped)

(Hand Axe adds extra shock...)
Geralt loses the rest of his combat pool due to shock!
(TN 8)  - Result: 0
Geralt is knocked to the ground. He'll lose half his CP next exchange as he stands up

Both attackers were successful, so the range doesn't change.

Cut & Thrust Kid rushes in to attack, while Geralt tries to hold him off...

------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

At the start of the round, we refresh both combat pools

Geralt loses 4 dice from leftover shock.
(TN 9) 4, 2, 7, 16, 8  - Result: 1
Geralt is bleeding, but does not lose Health this round.

------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

First engagement...

Geralt loses half his CP standing up

Cut & Thrust Kid loses 2 dice thanks to Geralt's bind maneuver.

Cut & Thrust Kid tries to bind Geralt's weapon with 4 dice, hoping to create an advantage for the next hit...
Geralt tries to block Cut & Thrust Kid's attack, using 2 dice...
(TN 5) 4, 9, 7, 2  - Result: 2
(TN 5) 9, 5  - Result: 2

Cut & Thrust Kid rolls and gets 2 successes.
Geralt rolls and gets 2 successes.

Geralt just barely avoids the attack from Cut & Thrust Kid, who keeps initiative.
------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Second engagement...

Cut & Thrust Kid takes a swing at Geralt's lower legs with 6 dice...
Geralt doesn't have enough dice left to defend with...
(TN 7) 2, 9, 5, 8, 5, 4  - Result: 2
(TN 5)  - Result: 0

Cut & Thrust Kid rolls and gets 2 successes.
Geralt rolls and gets 0 successes.

---------------------------------------
Attack successes: 2
Strength: 5
Weapon Damage: 1
---------------------------------------
Toughness: 5
Armor: 2
---------------------------------------

Cut & Thrust Kid hits Geralt with a total damage rating of 1... (Shin and lower leg.. ow!)

(Hand Axe adds extra shock...)
Geralt loses the rest of his combat pool due to shock!

------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

At the start of the round, we refresh both combat pools

Geralt loses 4 dice from leftover shock.
(TN 9) 2, 4, 9, 6, 8  - Result: 1
Geralt is bleeding, but does not lose Health this round.

------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

First engagement...

Cut & Thrust Kid tries to bind Geralt's weapon with 5 dice, hoping to create an advantage for the next hit...
Geralt tries to block Cut & Thrust Kid's attack, using 3 dice...
(TN 5) 6, 4, 2, 4, 9  - Result: 2
(TN 5) 6, 8, 6  - Result: 3

Cut & Thrust Kid rolls and gets 2 successes.
Geralt rolls and gets 3 successes.

So, Geralt successfully blocks the attack and steals initiative!
------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Second engagement...

Geralt must pay an additional 1 dice to attack because he's out of range.
Geralt chooses not to make an attack, and passes initiative to Cut & Thrust Kid

Cut & Thrust Kid takes a swing at Geralt's lower legs with 7 dice...
Geralt tries to block Cut & Thrust Kid's attack, using 2 dice...
(TN 7) 9, 9, 1, 6, 6, 8, 5  - Result: 3
(TN 5) 4, 4  - Result: 0

Cut & Thrust Kid rolls and gets 3 successes.
Geralt rolls and gets 0 successes.

---------------------------------------
Attack successes: 3
Strength: 5
Weapon Damage: 1
---------------------------------------
Toughness: 5
Armor: 2
---------------------------------------

Cut & Thrust Kid hits Geralt with a total damage rating of 2... (Shin bone chipped)

(Hand Axe adds extra shock...)
Geralt loses the rest of his combat pool due to shock!
(TN 7) 9, 1, 4, 18, 4, 8, 15  - Result: 4
Geralt is almost thrown to the ground, but keeps his footing.

------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

At the start of the round, we refresh both combat pools

Geralt loses 7 dice from leftover shock.
(TN 11) 8, 8, 3, 19, 2  - Result: 1
Geralt is bleeding, but does not lose Health this round.

------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

First engagement...

Cut & Thrust Kid takes a swing at Geralt's body (downward vertical) with 11 dice...
Geralt tries to block Cut & Thrust Kid's attack, using 2 dice...
(TN 7) 1, 4, 9, 1, 4, 18, 4, 8, 15, 8, 8  - Result: 6
(TN 5) 3, 19  - Result: 1

Cut & Thrust Kid rolls and gets 6 successes.
Geralt rolls and gets 1 successes.

---------------------------------------
Attack successes: 5
Strength: 5
Weapon Damage: 1
---------------------------------------
Toughness: 5
Armor: 4
---------------------------------------

Cut & Thrust Kid hits Geralt with a total damage rating of 2... (Deep cut to shoulder)

(Hand Axe adds extra shock...)
Geralt loses the rest of his combat pool due to shock!
------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Second engagement...

Both pools are at zero, so we'll end the round early.

------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

At the start of the round, we refresh both combat pools

Geralt loses 6 dice from leftover shock.
(TN 13) 8, 2, 4, 4, 2  - Result: 0
Geralt is still bleeding, and loses a health point.

------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

First engagement...

Cut & Thrust Kid takes a swing at Geralt's body (downward vertical) with 11 dice...
Geralt tries to block Cut & Thrust Kid's attack, using 3 dice...
(TN 7) 5, 6, 2, 4, 8, 8, 7, 7, 7, 9, 8  - Result: 7
(TN 5) 2, 2, 8  - Result: 1

Cut & Thrust Kid rolls and gets 7 successes.
Geralt rolls and gets 1 successes.

---------------------------------------
Attack successes: 6
Strength: 5
Weapon Damage: 1
---------------------------------------
Toughness: 5
Armor: 4
---------------------------------------

Cut & Thrust Kid hits Geralt with a total damage rating of 3... (Cracked skull)

(Hand Axe adds extra shock...)
Geralt loses the rest of his combat pool due to shock!
(TN 7) 9, 4, 1, 5  - Result: 1
Geralt is almost knocked unconscious by that blow, but struggles on.
------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Second engagement...

Both pools are at zero, so we'll end the round early.

------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

At the start of the round, we refresh both combat pools

Geralt loses his entire combat pool from leftover shock.
(TN 17) 4, 5, 8, 1, 2  - Result: 0
Geralt is still bleeding, and loses a health point.

------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

First engagement...

Cut & Thrust Kid takes a swing at Geralt's body (downward vertical) with 11 dice...
Geralt doesn't have enough dice left to defend with...
(TN 7) 2, 14, 5, 5, 8, 9, 9, 6, 6, 5, 8  - Result: 5
(TN 5)  - Result: 0

Cut & Thrust Kid rolls and gets 5 successes.
Geralt rolls and gets 0 successes.

---------------------------------------
Attack successes: 5
Strength: 5
Weapon Damage: 1
---------------------------------------
Toughness: 5
Armor: 4
---------------------------------------

Cut & Thrust Kid hits Geralt with a total damage rating of 2... (Dizziness and bleeding on head)

(Hand Axe adds extra shock...)
Geralt loses the rest of his combat pool due to shock!
(TN 7) 1, 18, 11, 19, 26, 9, 6, 7  - Result: 6
Geralt is almost knocked unconscious by that blow, but struggles on.
------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Second engagement...

Both pools are at zero, so we'll end the round early.

------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

At the start of the round, we refresh both combat pools

Geralt loses his entire combat pool due to pain.
(TN 20) 7, 6, 5, 2, 8  - Result: 0
Geralt is still bleeding, and loses a health point.

------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

First engagement...

Cut & Thrust Kid takes a swing at Geralt's midsection with 11 dice...
Geralt doesn't have enough dice left to defend with...
(TN 7) 9, 11, 18, 11, 19, 26, 9, 6, 7, 7, 6  - Result: 9
(TN 5)  - Result: 0

Cut & Thrust Kid rolls and gets 9 successes.
Geralt rolls and gets 0 successes.

---------------------------------------
Attack successes: 9
Strength: 5
Weapon Damage: 1
Bonus vs hard armor: 1
---------------------------------------
Toughness: 5
Armor: 10
---------------------------------------

Cut & Thrust Kid hits Geralt with a total damage rating of 1... (Light slash to ribcage)

(Hand Axe adds extra shock...)
Geralt loses the rest of his combat pool due to shock!
------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Second engagement...

Both pools are at zero, so we'll end the round early.

------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

At the start of the round, we refresh both combat pools

Geralt loses his entire combat pool due to pain.
(TN 20) 2, 5, 16, 9, 8  - Result: 0
Geralt is still bleeding, and loses a health point.
... and he's on his last legs (everything halved)

------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

First engagement...

Cut & Thrust Kid takes a swing at Geralt's body (downward vertical) with 11 dice...
Geralt doesn't have enough dice left to defend with...
(TN 7) 7, 2, 7, 7, 3, 14, 2, 2, 13, 2, 8  - Result: 6
(TN 5)  - Result: 0

Cut & Thrust Kid rolls and gets 6 successes.
Geralt rolls and gets 0 successes.

---------------------------------------
Attack successes: 6
Strength: 5
Weapon Damage: 1
---------------------------------------
Toughness: 2
Armor: 4
---------------------------------------

Cut & Thrust Kid hits Geralt with a total damage rating of 5... (Broken collarbone and ribs, heavy bleeding)

(Hand Axe adds extra shock...)
Geralt loses the rest of his combat pool due to shock!
------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Second engagement...

Both pools are at zero, so we'll end the round early.

------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

At the start of the round, we refresh both combat pools

Geralt is getting fatigued and loses 1CP

Geralt loses his entire combat pool due to pain.
(TN 45) 9, 1  - Result: 0
Geralt is still bleeding, and loses a health point.
... and he finally succumbs, slipping into merciful unconsciousness as the last of his blood drains away...

------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Combat over!

You can now reload characters (or make new ones) and click FIGHT again, or QUIT

Note - you must reload the characters, or you will start the next battle with their curent stats (likely to be depleted by the combat they've just had). If I made it 'auto-reload' it would wipe out unsaved changes you might want.

[Muggins]

Sheesh! Considering that in the last lot Cut&Thrust had the advantage in most exchanges, he should have been able to hammer home his advantage. If you have extra dice, thrust (lower TN, more successes...). I have only had one fight go past 5 exchanges in the game, and that was a howler: wimpy but skilled bloke with rapier against average armoured thug. Wimp hit almost every time, but filed to damage. So eventually he swapped target location and slowly (I mean slowly) whittled the guy down. I eventually let one of the other fighters join in!

James

[Valamir]

Lokdu...can you explain to me the logic of your strategy in these fights?

What you are doing seems custom made to intentionally make a fight last as long as possible.  Is it just newness with the system?

There is absolutely no reason for two fighters of roughly similiar dice pools and TNs to try to bind each other 6 times in a row.  Its like a box match where no one throws a punch and just goes into clinch after clinch.

My advice is to quit with the binds and just nail the guy.  Binds have their tactical uses...but not every single swing.


Try this...
C&T: Launches 2-3 die attack to an underarmored area.
G: Defends with 3-4
C&T: Feints drops in all but 1 of remaining dice.

Chances are G gets nailed.

or:  
C&T: Launches 2-3 die attack to an underarmored area.
G: suspecting a feint, defends with 5-6
C&T: does not feint and lets G waste a bunch of dice.
G:  wins initiative and attacks with depleted die pool
C&T: uses dice advantage to launch a simo block & strike (if he has a buckler, I forget now if C&T has one...if not, there are other defensive choices to use.

or:
C&T: Launches 2-3 die attack to an underarmored area.
G: defends with 3-4.
C&T: does not feint
G: wins initiative and for second part of exchange attacks with remaining dice.
C&T: spends 2 dice to declare a counter...since G is attacking with alot of dice, if the counter works, C&T will wind up with alot of bonus dice for his next attack.

or:
C&T: Launches 2-3 die attack to an under armored area.
G: uses a bunch of dice to duck and weave
G: wins initiative and has a nice advantage thanks to the D&W.

That's 4 possible outcomes just from starting with a probing attacking from C&T.  Multiply that by all of the other types of attacks C&T could have launched, and I think you'll begin to see the huge decision tree range of possible outcomes.

Bind/parry, Bind/parry, Bind/parry isn't going to kill anyone very fast.

[[MKF]Kapten]

Remember the fatigue rules. In a combat like this, the endurance of the warriors will matter. It works good in boxing and I suppose it would work in this situation as well.

[lokdu]

Well in the fight i try to simulate 2 warriors with good armor + shield and cut weapon (axe and 1 hand cut sword ) .
With pretty good armor + shield  most  of the hit give no wound against 5 con + 2 to 4 armor + 6 or 8 shield.
Shield is very strong , low DTN and very high armor value . Except duck and weave no way to ignore it .
So attack with 4 to 8 dice cant hurt . Look like you need to attack with most of your dice or never have a chance to hurt your opponent.
If i bind and strike a lot it's because cut , thrust , and feint give only 0 dammage in this fight and i need my opponent loose some dice for a good hit.
Yes i'm new with TROS , usually i play with pendragon when i want some medieval fight. TROS look like what i need for my game of throne campaign if i can learn how 2 knights can fight less than 2 days before 1 of them win :-)

If you can show me how you can win the fight with some TROS simulator screen  shot i will be very happy to learn.

opponents 1 : large shield  + chain + leather for legs and pot helm.
                    weapon : arming sword
                    proficiencie : sword and shield 8
                   
opponent 2  : medium shield + chain + leather for legs and pot helm.
                   weapon : 1 hand axe
                    proficiencie : sword (axe) and shield 8

[Valamir]

well, you only count the shield AV if you attack an area protected by the shield.  Simple matter to not attack an area protected by the shield and then the shield never applies.  

What strength do you have for this guy?  If his strength is the same as the opponent's TO than attacking the leather armored legs should only require 3 successes to do a level 1 wound to the legs.  At that point the shock should really start to give someone the advantage.

Alls you need to do is to figure out a way to get 3 successes.

I suggest trying some of the suggestions I gave in my last post.  I've never had a combat between lightly armored guys go that long...ever.

[Ian.Plumb]

Hi,

Alls you need to do is to figure out a way to get 3 successes.

If you want to see something really funny with the Combat Simulator, create two ordinary characters -- call one Punch and the other Judy -- give them no combat skills and average stats (they are ordinary people, not ordinary warriors) and arm them with a club and no armour.

I've had one of these combats go for fourteen rounds -- where one character is stunned after the first round (no CP thereafter) and the other wails into them with all their CP, round after round...

I raise this point to illustrate that at extremes any set of mechanics breaks down a little. With a CP of 4 neither character has much chance at all of getting three successes even with a stunned opponent. Similarly in the (r e a l l y   l o n g) examples posted above, when there is no point to the fight (that is, no SAs involved) combats will go longer than in a real game. While the tactics used play a part, perhaps the game mechanics anticipate most exchanges involving higher CPs, at least on one side as the PC uses their SAs?

Cheers,

[lokdu]

3 success do nothing ie :

First engagement...

Max Steele takes a swing at Cut & Thrust Kid's body (downward vertical) with 8 dice...
Cut & Thrust Kid tries to block Max Steele's attack, using 4 dice...
(TN 6) 19, 3, 7, 19, 4, 8, 16, 7  - Result: 6
(TN 5) 2, 17, 13, 26  - Result: 3

Max Steele rolls and gets 6 successes.
Cut & Thrust Kid rolls and gets 3 successes.

---------------------------------------
Attack successes: 3
Strength: 5
Weapon Damage: 1
---------------------------------------
Toughness: 5
Armor: 4
---------------------------------------

Max Steele hits Cut & Thrust Kid with a total damage rating of 0... (Merely a scratch...)

Lool like the toughness is too much as soon you have some decent armor.
I think armor should give more protection ( chain 5 or 6 ) and toughness no dammage protection. Flesh against steel hummm yes no protection .

[Alan]

Hi Lokdu,

Welcome to the Forum.

Both your inquiries about unresolved combat exchanges and the value of toughness and armor have been extensively discussed her before.  The sticky at the top of the forum contains a summary of links to these discussions.  http://www.indie-rpgs.com/viewtopic.php?t=7840" >Forum Directory (useful for Newbies)

My answer to your battle:

If you keep getting the same result doing the same thing, do something different.  One thing I quickly learned playing TROS is that a smart fighter attacks unarmored locations.  If you swing for an unarmored location like the leg, the result is a level 4 wound.  

Say the result is a thigh: that's a broken femur - 10 Shock, 10-WP in Pain, and (KD - 4 dice) at TN 7.  The guy is toast.

TROS is all about choices - Spiritual Attribute choices most of all, but tactical choices as well.  Wearing good armor forces opponents to attack your weak points, and then you have to change your defence style to match.  TROS is not a game where character's can exchange wounding hits for any length of time.  Usually the first wound wins the fight.

[Valamir]

Max Steele takes a swing at Cut & Thrust Kid's body

...

Armor: 4

Why would you do that?

You know you don't have a particularly strong character.
You know that you don't have a weapon that is particularly effective against armor.
Why would you knowingly attack your opponent's most heavily armored area?

Its a very simple matter to defeat armor...don't swing where the armor is.

If you'd made the same attack against a location armored in only leather, you'd have done a level 2 wound.

If you're facing an opponent with heavy armor on all of his locations then you'd better

a) take advantage of the large CP penalty he's suffering from from all that armor.  and/or

b) get yourself a weapon designed to fight armored opponents...like an estoc or pole axe. or

c) be prepared to fight a long drawn out battle waiting for your opponent to get tired (which heavily armored guys generally do faster than lightly armored ones).

[Edge]

Yeah also i can see that you were attacking with a downward swing alot of the time, replace that with a swing to the arms or a thrust to the head and things would start to change.  Depending on whether his chain shirt hangs down low you could also try a swing to the groin.

The thrust to the head and swing to the groin both create fight ending wounds while the swing to the arm could take the arm or hand off and then you will certainly win the fight.