RPG Mechanics Survey

[NeuroZombie]

I am in the process of creating a system for a cross-genre rpg (name pending more background material.)  I have been brainstorming different stat methods, skill systems, class vs no-class, etc.... and would love for your opinions on the following points.  You can note your choices by number-letter or (if you would be so kind) explain why you like the choice you made.  Also, feel free to write in any options that I do not note, as I know this list is FAR from all encompasing.  Examples are in () for some of them.


1) Rules Set
    a. Generic
    b. Setting Specific (As if I really have to ask)

2) Character Design
    a. Point Based (GURPS)
    b. Random Stats + Skills
    c. Archetypes:
         1-Class gives all abilities and experience paths (D20)
         2-Class details PC at start of game only
         3-Skill packages that can be bought that give certain skill sets
    d. Skill based only
    e. Free form (skills and stats determined by description)

3) Stats/Attributes
    a. Few (Mind Body Spirit)
    b. Moderate (5-8, ala D20)
    c. Many (10+)

4) General Mechanics
     a. % Based
         1-Roll Under (BRPS)
         2-Roll Over (Rolemaster)
    b. Skill + Stat Bonus + Circumstance vs. Target Number (d20)
    c. Dice Pool
         1-Add up all dice vs. TN (WEG d6)
         2-Each die rolled vs. TN, ea. die above TN is a success (White Wolf)
     d. Die Step.  Each "level" of skill/stat/difficulty is equivalent to a die:
         No Skill = d4, Novice = d6, Trained = d8 etc...

5) Skill / Stat Relationship
    a. Skill modified by Stat
    b. Die roll based on Stats; TN = Skill Level (or Vise Versa)
    c. Seperate

6) Combat Part 1
    a. Part of universal skill system
    b. Seperate system
    c. Seperate but similar (d20)

7) Combat Part 2
    a. Realistic/lethal
    b. Cinematic

8) Combat Part 3
    a. Hit Points, escalating scale (D20)
    b. Hit Points, Fixed scale
    c. Wound Levels (White Wolf)


This is by no means a complete list of considerations, just the ones that have topped my brain.  Any and all thoughts are highly welcome as I want this (RPG) system to appeal to as many players as possible, while also appealing to my asthetics.

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[BPetroff93]

Hi Neuro and welcome to the forge!  What do you want this system to actually DO?  What style of play do you wish to reward?

[Mourglin]

1) Rules Set
B
Comment:  I think systems that have rules tailored to the genre/theme are better.  Many specific situations arise out of setting specifc games, having a rules set that addresses these situations (well) should be better than a generic application that attempts to be a "jack of all trades, master of none".

2) Character Design
B
Comment: I have always been torn between random stat generation and using a point based system.   A problem I have found that pertains to this and affects question 3 is the number of stats.  Usually fewer stats in a game end up being equal in game value and application for a player, e.g., they are all important.   Having to many usualy leads to stat "stacking" where only the better ones are allocated with good values and the rest are forgotten or rarely come up.

3) Stats/Attributes
C
Comment:  See above.  I think its nice to have as many stats as you need as long as they are balanced amongst one another and make sense.  For example I would not have a problem with a game that had a Quickness or Speed, Agility and even a Reflexes stat as opposed to say just having a Quickness stat.  As long as they were related some how (which I believe those 3 stats are) and had equal balance within the system.  

4) General Mechanics
A
Comment:  I think % systems are easy to embrace and make better sense for people.  Just an opinion of course. :)

5) Skill / Stat Relationship
A
Comment:   I don't see how stats influence can be ignored when it comes to skills.  There is a definate relationship here but quantifying this is up to you as a designer.

6) Combat Part 1
A
Comment: If combat resolution can fit into the broader design of the system (a % based) for example, I think there would be definate benefits, and I would think the learning curve would be one.

6) Combat Part 2
A & B (leaning to B)
Comment: Making combat too deadly will likely take away the heroic level of the game and perhaps draw in the simulationists a bit more.  I like a nice mix of the two.  Combat needs to be lethal of course, but if a delicate balance can be struck between that and a semi moderate level of Heroism you can get some of the benefits of both worlds and perhaps draw from 2 types of gamers.

6) Combat Part 3
C (but I don't like hit points in general)
Comment:  Wound levels are nice and I would prefer them over hit points.  Harmmaster had a nice way to implementing damage if your looking for a hitpointless style using wound levels.  

Some of the questions you ask are very similar to a Survey I proposed posting on these boards back a few weeks ago.  I believe they are a good tool and good info can be gathered or at least opinions.  Best of luck and I hope my short answers were enough to give you what you were looking for.

Best

Mourglin

[xiombarg]

Seriously, man, you should focus on what YOU want. Building a system from a survey is going to result in a bland, generic system with no passion, no spark, and little different from FUDGE or GURPS.

[NeuroZombie]

Seriously, man, you should focus on what YOU want. Building a system from a survey is going to result in a bland, generic system with no passion, no spark, and little different from FUDGE or GURPS.

I do not intend on building a system from a survey, I just wanted to see what people liked in the way of mechanics.  I could design my game and no one would care for the mechanics, or I can at least see what people like so as to have a good basis for basic concepts.  I have a lot of preliminary notes, brainstorming and research done at the moment, and I just wanted some opinions before I go into depth on what I want to do and turn out an rpg that no one will want to play.

[montag]

I do not intend on building a system from a survey, I just wanted to see what people liked in the way of mechanics.  I could design my game and no one would care for the mechanics, or I can at least see what people like so as to have a good basis for basic concepts.  I have a lot of preliminary notes, brainstorming and research done at the moment, and I just wanted some opinions before I go into depth on what I want to do and turn out an rpg that no one will want to play.

People will like any mechanics provided they're not too arcane if said mechanics reinforce the intended style of the game.
Basically, if people want to have a certain gaming experience, they'll jump through a lot of hoops if those hoops help them get what they want. If the mechanics are in the way, they can be as simple or "popular" as they want, and will still be a nuisance to players.
So unless you're going for a generic system (good luck replacing GURPS and Fudge ;) your survey is simply going to be huge waste of time because it's not going to tell you what mechanics you'll need for your game. In other words, neither CoC nor Exalted would benefit from mechanics which appeal to the most number of people, since it's the specialised mechanics for each game, which give the game its unique feel and make it interesting.

[M. J. Young]

I'm afraid I'm going to agree with Xiombarg and Montag. I would probably disagree with them on answers to specific questions, and that means all you get from the survey is a batch of individual opinions.

My opinions about what makes a good system are incorporated in my designs. Multiverser isn't really generic or setting specific--it's setting specific to a setting that covers anything you can imagine as discrete places. Character design is essentially imagine what you want and then define it in system terms--no points, no rolls, no lifepaths, no archetypes, no limits. Attributes are on the high end for your scale. Skills are resolved by percentile (roll under, chance based on attribute+skill+bias+/-mods, relative success, relative failure, and botch built into the one roll), but it also includes a couple of other rolls (3d10 against chart, 2d20 against attribute, d30+10 against attribute). As mentioned, skill rolls always include an attribute in chance of success; in some cases, additional attributes may modify this. Combat is part of the core system, although there are specific nuances to it in terms of modifiers that normally apply. (The same can be said of magic and psionics.) Realism is a meaningless term, but in Multiverser it can shift between cinematic and deadly pretty easily--but that deadly never means death for PCs. There's a fixed scale for damage, hit-point-like, based on attributes.

Now, for that game, those were the decisions. I might do it all entirely different for a different game. How is a character killed or wounded in Legends of Alyria? The players agree that the character is killed or wounded. That's it--that's the entire system.

As far as appealing to as many gamers as possible, the way you achieve that is:

[*]Design something that you enjoy playing;[*]Explain it clearly so others can reproduce what you're doing;[*]Get it out there to hook them into it.[/list:u]That's really all there is to it.

Of course, that's the challenge, isn't it?

--M. J. Young

[NeuroZombie]

As far as appealing to as many gamers as possible, the way you achieve that is:

[*]Design something that you enjoy playing;[*]Explain it clearly so others can reproduce what you're doing;[*]Get it out there to hook them into it.[/list:u]That's really all there is to it.

Of course, that's the challenge, isn't it?

--M. J. Young

That is most definetly the challenge, not an insurmountable one, but one nonetheless.  

This post was not intended to come across the way that all of you seem to be making it.  I know AND agree with what each of you are saying, and I fully intended to do the same things that you have stated. I just wanted to see what people prefer, thats all.  A movie studio does pre-screenings, a game company does playtesting... I just wanted to take it a few steps back from that and see whats what.

As a side note, the setting is cross-genre, but NOT generic.  It is a blend of fantasy, sci-fi, cyberpunk, supers and bits and pieces from other genres.  It will be high adventure ala Exalted, but with more options built in.  My inspirations are:

Crossgen comics
Many time travel/steampunk/mixed genre novels
Games such as Rifts (bleech system, but some cool ideas), shadowrun, Synibarr (see rifts note) etc...

When I get some more details written up, I will post them here for you guys to comment on.  So far, I am still in the brainstorming phase.