Using the D20 system

[Sentience]

I'm having a hard time deciding whether or not to use the OGL and the D20 system for the RPG I'm creating. However, I believe I could come to a conclussion if I understood my limitations when using those systems. Can someone explain what I can and can't do with the D20 system, or otherwise point me to a source that can explain it?

Thanks in advance.

[Mcrow]

you can use anything on d20srd.org word for word.

The Wizards versions.

You can copy and past from the SRDs if you like, but anything that is in  WotC books that is not listed in the SRD is of limits. Mostly its names of people,places, and things that are WotC's IP. You may also want to stear clear of anything that closely resembles any WotC IP. You can take the SRD and modify the rules any which way you like and it is still legal so as you include the OGL license in the book.

[Sentience]

Hmm...So, could I take the basics of the D20 system and change the entire way you create a character? Say, create a classless character creation system? Change the way Armor Class and hit points work? Create a character creation program that lets you create a character on your computer?


I guess what I'm getting at is: Can I makethe D20 system my own, meaning change it so that it specifically fits my setting without WotC sending me a sapena?

[Mcrow]

correct.

You may want to check intot he software thing, I know WotC seems to be a little more pushy about software, which IIRC, is not included in the OGL license.

[Sentience]

Thank you muchly

I think it's safe to assume you're the same mcrow on the aftermathrpg forums?

[Mcrow]

yup, chances are if you see an Mcrow on any rpg forum, its me.

[Sentience]

After looking through the D20 SRD, I found this:

"No Covered Product may contain rules or instructions of any kind that:

Describe a process for Creating a Character
Describe a process for Applying the Effects of Experience to a Character"


So now I'm confused. Am I correct in saying that if you use the D20 system, your book will not be a stand alone product? Meaning, the customer would also have to have access to D20 Modern or D&D books?

[Mcrow]

After looking through the D20 SRD, I found this:

"No Covered Product may contain rules or instructions of any kind that:

Describe a process for Creating a Character
Describe a process for Applying the Effects of Experience to a Character"


So now I'm confused. Am I correct in saying that if you use the D20 system, your book will not be a stand alone product? Meaning, the customer would also have to have access to D20 Modern or D&D books?

theres a difference between the "d20" license and the OGL license.  If you intend to use the d20 logo you can't have the two things you listed above in the book and you must also have a blurb someplace on the cover that says "requires D&D players handbook".  If you use OGL, then you can do whatever you like with the system, including making a complete game with character generation but you do not have to mention the PHB.

[Sentience]

Ahhh. I seeeeeee. Okay, one last question.

Honestly, the only thing I like about the D20 system is the core mechanic, being "Roll a D20, add modifiers, see if it's over the target number."

If I were to use that mechanic, would I still have to list the OGL in the book? Or is that core mechanic free to use?

[Mcrow]

Well, your best bet is just to use the OGL incase WotC takes exception, which they could. A lot of non-d20 games that use similar core mechanics use the OGL.

[Sentience]

Dude, thats pretty weak. The fact that WotC can basically intimidate people who'd like to use anything similar to their system into using their OGL kind of gives them a monopoly. Thats like claiming rights to a basic mathematic principle. I'm just going to scrap the idea of using a D20. I don't want to have to answer to Wizards when it comes to making my game. If they can dictate what rules I can and can't use, and what sort of things I can do with the game, then I don't want to bother.

[Ben Lehman]

You are not well off taking advice on copyright from a guy on an RPG design board.  The Forge isn't a great source of legal information, but there is a copyright sticky in the Publishing forum, I think, with links to places to get actual information (like the US copyright office) and not hearsay.  You should check it out.

yrs--
--Ben

[TroyLovesRPG]

Frankly, you have to be a savvy lawyer to really understand how OGLs, Copyrights, Trademarks, Intellectual Property and Licensing work. WotC have lawyers and the money to back them. However, don't let that intimidate you into submission or prevent you from creating something new and exciting.

One company has taken the OGL from WotC and used it as the basis of their True20 system. They've done their homework and it shows in their products and confidence as a publisher. Take a look at www.True20.com and you will see how they have created a system that throws out what Wizards lays claim to owning. There is no red D20 system logo on their cover and they don't have to have it. Their product is not completely D&D 3.5 compatible, but uses the OGL in an alternative way. In fact, their creation is so unique they can actually offer licensing of the True20 System independently of D20. I applaud them.

The use of the polyhedra dice is not owned by anyone. How those dice are used with intellectual property is definitely owned. Honestly, you can use the 20-sided dice in your game. You can call it a d20, just not the d20 system. Read the SRD 3.5 OGL and the D20 System license and it tells you exactly what you can and cannot do. Honestly, many companies profit from the OGL and D20 licensing. WotC is a mighty force and it isn't a terrible thing to ride their wake. Just don't rock the boat while you're doing it.

Troy

[Sentience]

Thanks for the replies guys. I actually checked out True20 and was thoroughly impressed. They certainly did a good job  in making the OGL their *****. I plan on picking up a copy of their material for no other reason then to support what they're doing.

Also, thanks for recommending the Copyright Thread in Publishing. I went to http://www.copyright.gov/fls/fl108.html and found this of particular interest:

Copyright protection does not extend to any idea, system, method, device, or trademark material involved in the development, merchandising, or playing of a game.

Thanks for the help guys. I'm still undecided whether or not I'll use the D20 in the core mechanic of the game. Honestly, I'd like to use something different for the sake of being original, but since they don't make anything greater then a D20 and less then a full D100 (that are commonly available) my choices are somewhat limited.

[TroyLovesRPG]

The d20 is a specific type of die used in many different games. Using a d20 doesn't require permission from WotC or their OGL. D20 System is a registered trademark and you can't use that without following the OGL and license. So, if you want to use a twenty-sided die in your RPG, nothing is stopping you. If you truly have original ideas for an RPG that uses a d20 to generate a random number, please develop it. If all your ideas are just offshoots from D&D and the D20 system, then your RPG isn't unique and it would be best for you to adhere to their licensing agreements.

Generating random numbers by rolling a d4, d6, d8, d12, d20, d100, flipping coins, pulling tokens out of a bag or using a spinner are just game components. Your RPG may or may not require those, depending on what you want to achieve. That you like using a d20 is perfectly fine. Spend more time on how the players involve themselves with the game. Create a completely new way of generating characters, resolving actions and advancement. Use a d20 in a way that hasn't been done.

Troy