[Babel] 2nd try, system theory and numbers light

[Ar Kayon]

[Ar Kayon]

Error: "face off" would probably be an active defensive response instead, since no defense precedes it.

[Mobius]

Hello again Ar Kayon,

Thank you for the suggestions.  Some thoughts.

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Mobius a.k.a Charles

[brianbloodaxe]

Two thoughts I have had about this:

- Working back through a chain of attacks, counters, follow ups, defencive riposts, attacker defences, etc might get confusing and there is nothing more annoying than working through five actions only to forget the details of the initial attack. You might be better off providing the players with cards for each of their abilities so that they can move the cards into a central play area giving a visual representation of the combat sequence. The cards can also be a valuable reference for the different attacks. (I realise that D&D4and WFRP3 may already do something like this but I'm not sure as I have played neither - I am simply remembering chains of instants and interrupts twelve years ago in Magic: The Gathering)

- The basic dice mechanic is roll as many dice as you have points in the skill and each that rolls over a target (determined by deducting your stat from 10) is a success. Why not remove a level of complexity and have the dice pass if they roll equal to or less than your stat? You would need to increase all stats by 1 during character gen but that shouldn't be a problem.

[Mobius]

Two thoughts I have had about this:

- Working back through a chain of attacks, counters, follow ups, defencive riposts, attacker defences, etc might get confusing and there is nothing more annoying than working through five actions only to forget the details of the initial attack. You might be better off providing the players with cards for each of their abilities so that they can move the cards into a central play area giving a visual representation of the combat sequence. The cards can also be a valuable reference for the different attacks. (I realise that D&D4and WFRP3 may already do something like this but I'm not sure as I have played neither - I am simply remembering chains of instants and interrupts twelve years ago in Magic: The Gathering)

I do visualize this system almost like playing cards.  Many of the powers are resolved immediately so hopefully that will reduce the need to work back through things.  Having said that I can see some spots in my example where I forgot to add a modifier provided by a counter so some sort of system of tracking that may be needed. Or perhaps as Ar Kayon  suggests a simplification of the system.

- The basic dice mechanic is roll as many dice as you have points in the skill and each that rolls over a target (determined by deducting your stat from 10) is a success. Why not remove a level of complexity and have the dice pass if they roll equal to or less than your stat? You would need to increase all stats by 1 during character gen but that shouldn't be a problem.

I'd not thought of that, I guess because I am used to a high roll being good.  I wonder which is harder for most players; to use a derived number which needs to be calculated once or adjust to wanting to roll a 1.  Anyone else have an opinion on that?

[Mobius]

Oh and because I forgot to say it thank you for the feedback!  I really appreciate everyone's thoughts and time. 

[Mobius]

Going through my game with an eye towards simplifying the system one of the first things that jumped out at me is the number of  penalties and modifiers I gave a large number of abilities in order to balance them.  Right now they are very add hock but I'd like to standardize them into a few easy to remember status conditions.

This requires some minor changes in the abilities but overall I think it is worth it.

Right now I am thinking:
Bleeding: A character who is bleeding takes 1 level of irresistible damage at the start of his turn, after which he may make a Con check to stop the bleeding. He continues to bleeding until he heals at least one level of lethal damage, a successful Medical check is made on him, or he succeeds at the Con check.
Bleeding profusely: A character who is bleeding profusely takes 5 dice [7] of irresistible damage at the start of each turn. He continues to bleeding profusely until he heals at least one level of lethal damage or a successful Medical check is made on him at a 3 dice penalty.
Crippled  All rolls made while crippled take a 1 die penalty and all natural movement is reduced by 3 inches.
Exposed: All defensive counter rolls made while exposed take a 2 dice penalty.
Off Balance: All attack rolls made take a 2 dice accuracy penalty.
Slow:  Any Defensive Counter roll made against a slow attack gains a 1 die bonus.
Staggered: All rolls made while staggered take a 1 die penalty.
Vicious: Any stun or K.O. checks made as the result of a vicious attack take a 1 die penalty.

Another thing I want to do is standardize multiple attacks into two categories. 
Combined Attack: When you make a combined attack two or more attack rolls are resolved simultaneously.  All attacks made must be against the same target and  bonuses to damage or accuracy only applies to one attack. Your target's Defensive Counter applies to both attacks. You may only make one Follow-up to a combined attack regardless of the number of attack rolls you make.

Multiple Attack: When making multiple attacks each attack is fully resolved before moving on to the next.  You may only make a Follow-up to the last attack roll.

Some examples of what the changes would look like.

Double Tap: Make two attack rolls against your target as if you were Shooting, each with a 1 die penalty to accuracy.  Both attacks are resolved simultaneously. Any bonuses to damage or accuracy only applies to one attack and your target's Defensive Counter applies to both attacks.  After your targets Defensive Counter is resolved you may only use one Offensive Counter which also takes a 1 die penalty to accuracy.
                     Special: You must be able to handle the recoil of the weapon used. 

Becomes

Double Tap: Shoot your target twice with a 1 die penalty to accuracy.  This is a Combined Attack.
                     Special: You must be able to handle the recoil of the weapon used. 

Double-Kick: Make a Snap Kick attack against your target.  After that attack is fully resolved make a Side Kick attack against the same target.
                        Special: Until the start of your next turn all attack rolls against you gain a 2 dice bonus

Becomes

Double-Kick: As a Multiple Attack make a Snap Kick followed by a Side Kick.  Using Double-Kick leaves you Exposed until the beginning of your next turn.

Crippling Wound
Melee Offensive Counter, Recoverable
Effect: If the triggering attack hit and did at least one level of damage your target takes a 2 dice penalty to attack rolls and a 3 inch penalty to any movement until the end of his next turn.

Becomes

Crippling Wound
Melee Offensive Counter, Recoverable
Effect: If the triggering attack hit and did at least one level of damage your target is Crippled until the end of his next turn.

And

Bleeding Wound
Melee Offensive Counter, Recoverable
Effect:  If the triggering attack hit and did at least one level of lethal damage then at the beginning of your target's next turn he takes 1 level of irresistible lethal damage, after which he may make a Con check to stop the bleeding. He continues to take damage at the beginning of each turn until he heals at least one level of lethal damage, a successful Medical check is made on him, or he succeeds at the Con check.
             Special: The target must be able to bleed in some way for this counter to be effective.

Becomes:

Bleeding Wound
Melee Offensive Counter, Recoverable
Effect:  If the triggering attack hit and did at least one level of lethal damage the target is Bleeding.

Immunity to bleeding would then be handled in the creatures description.

Does anyone see a reason not make this update?

[Mobius]

Also does anyone have a suggestion for a replacement term for Multiple Attack?  I'm finding it awkward to work into ability descriptions.

[SAW]

Also does anyone have a suggestion for a replacement term for Multiple Attack?  I'm finding it awkward to work into ability descriptions.

Flurry?
Barrage?
Blitz?